Reta Microdosing (<1.5mg) to improve lipids?

[Banana Joe]

I had already asked here, but it sadly didn't get any replies.

How many of you guys are taking microdoses of Reta (<1.5mg?) mainly to improve HDL/LDL?
I have seen quite a few people on YT making similar claims, but Big Paul is the first one that provided actual numbers.

Other benefits should be:
- improved insulin sensitivity (might be even a given)
- reduced visceral and liver fat via glucagon receptor signaling


I always had bad HDL/LDL (hereditary) and have started taking 0.2mg e2d of Reta just recently. So far I feel no reduction in appetite, which is critical for me, as I have become a terrible eater over the years. If I feel no ill effects, I might up the dose to 0.3mg e2d.
Haven't gotten a new blood panel as my diet is a bit terrible atm, and I need to fix that first to get any meaningful data.

 

[ChemBB]

4mg of Pita. if that's what you're asking.

Those lipids aren't that bad on gear. Either Pita or a combo of Eze and Bemp would get you into the reasonably safe sub 70 LDL range.

Ah, I misinterpreted that as you saying you were running all 3. I was about to say...

> Those lipids aren't that bad

At one point when I wasn't training, I had triglycerides at +700
Have severe familial hyperlipidemia and history of cardiac events, though

 

[Ghoul]

Ah, I misinterpreted that as you saying you were running all 3. I was about to say...

> Those lipids aren't that bad

At one point when I wasn't training, I had triglycerides at +700
Have severe familial hyperlipidemia and history of cardiac events, though

View attachment 348915

I do take all 3.

I played the "I can't tolerate ANY statin doc!" game for a couple of months to build the record necessary to get Repatha approved. Then I added Pita to the Eze I was already using to drive LDL into the 30's. basically applying the "multiple heart attacks" guideline target (sub 40 LDL),

Those targets are primarily determined by cost effectiveness, so this high cost, highly protective regimen is reserved for "proven" high risk patients.

I just decided I'd rather be proactive, instead of waiting for 2 potential deadly incidents before being "worth" the highest level of protection lol.

The fact there was a way it could be done without side effects is what sealed my decision to go this route.

If you're in the US, familial hyperlipidemia is enough to qualify for Repatha coverage if you go through a couple of statins and complain of muscle pain, FYI.

You can see why it's worth the effort to get insurance to cover it from my receipt, lol

 

[ChemBB]

If you're in the US, familial hyperlipidemia is enough to qualify for Repatha coverage if you go through a couple of statins and complain of muscle pain, FYI.

You can see why it's worth the effort to get insurance to cover it from my receipt, lol

View attachment 348917

Taking 3 drugs for cholesterol seems a bit wild to me, but I can see the logic in it.

If you are certain it won't negatively impact your muscle growth or quality of life, no reason not to I guess, outside of the tedium of managing all the RX'es. (I already have a billion anyways...)

I'd never heard of this antibody for LDL. I was on Atorvastatin for a long time, have my DNA sequenced, with alleles for all sorts of negative cardiovascular traits, plus family history.

Might look into getting this -- thanks

 

[Ateam2023]

I do take all 3.

I played the "I can't tolerate ANY statin doc!" game for a couple of months to build the record necessary to get Repatha approved. Then I added Pita to the Eze I was already using to drive LDL into the 30's. basically applying the "multiple heart attacks" guideline target (sub 40 LDL),

Those targets are primarily determined by cost effectiveness, so this high cost, highly protective regimen is reserved for "proven" high risk patients.

I just decided I'd rather be proactive, instead of waiting for 2 potential deadly incidents before being "worth" the highest level of protection lol.

The fact there was a way it could be done without side effects is what sealed my decision to go this route.

If you're in the US, familial hyperlipidemia is enough to qualify for Repatha coverage if you go through a couple of statins and complain of muscle pain, FYI.

You can see why it's worth the effort to get insurance to cover it from my receipt, lol

View attachment 348917

that stuff is expensive, but at least you have insurance covering most of it,

 

[Ghoul]

that stuff is expensive, but at least you have insurance covering most of it,

Amgen lowered the price from $15,000 / yr to $6,000 (for insurance companies), and more recently agreed to give them rebates bringing it down to $3,600 IF they loosened their pre-approval requirements so more people would qualify. Most insurance companies took that offer and it's very easy for most people with elevated LDL to qualify now. It was almost impossible until recently.

If you're only willing to do one drug for lipid control, Repatha is it. The absolute lowest rate of side effects of all the options, just a single pen based injection every two weeks, and more effective than the most potent statins.

 

[ChemBB]

If you're only willing to do one drug for lipid control, Repatha is it. The absolute lowest rate of side effects of all the options, just a single pen based injection every two weeks, and more effective than the most potent statins.

Here's to hoping that some breakthrough in biologics production gives us underground monoclonal antibody production so we can get our hands on stuff like Evolocumab, Trevogrumab/Garetosmab at some reasonable price...

That'll be stop #1, where the last and final stop is DIY underground gene editing, AKA: "Son, we have CRISPR-Cas9 at home."

 

[Nidus]

Neither Ezetimebe or Bempodoic acid is likely to cause sides. Neither has anything to do with the way statins work, they're completely different, so don't let psychosomatic "statinphobia" make your muscles start to hurt after you start using them, lol.

Most primary care doctors don't care about your longevity, and stopped keeping up with current knowledge shortly after graduating medical school. To most, it's a job and they do the bare minimum.

A preventative cardiologist would be far more proactive and consider your long term health in ways most PCPs just don't give a shit about.

My cardiogolist prescribes anyone with LDL higher than 70 Ezemtibe right away, anything above 100 for him is already critical and thats where he throws Bempoic Acid on top it.

Currently trying to get Repatha through him too as my family history is fucked genetically speaking in the regards to LDL with markers over 300 running in the family and extremely low HDL (usually around 20-25)

 

[Ghoul]

Taking 3 drugs for cholesterol seems a bit wild to me, but I can see the logic in it.

If you are certain it won't negatively impact your muscle growth or quality of life, no reason not to I guess, outside of the tedium of managing all the RX'es. (I already have a billion anyways...)

I'd never heard of this antibody for LDL. I was on Atorvastatin for a long time, have my DNA sequenced, with alleles for all sorts of negative cardiovascular traits, plus family history.

Might look into getting this -- thanks

Fairly sure you're at the "automatic qualifier" level at this point. Just mention to your doc you occasionally feel muscle soreness while exercising and would like to try Repatha as a substitute for the statin. Once you get it you can always add the statin (or another) back on. Once qualified you'll essentially be covered for this class of RNA modifying lipid meds forever.

Sign up for the Repatha co-pay card on the Repatha website and your copay will be reduced to either $0 or $15 per month.

Personally I see people taking a pile of unproven, unregulated "supplements" who hesitate at the thought of using much more tightly controlled and large scale trial proven (for safety and effectiveness) compounds because they consider "pharma drugs" as something threatening.

As far as this triple "stack", it's in line with the latest "evidence based guidelines" from numerous cardiovascular organizations.

Attacking chronic conditions (like BP) using different mechanisms of action is a strategy that's used for many health issues now, both for greater effectiveness and lowering the risk of sides (vs a single drug at very high doses). This is only possible because modern meds are tightly focused with no or minimal "off target" effects. Older drugs were more like shotguns, and combinations risked harmful interactions. Now we're using sniper rifles.

The reason the most effective, proven risk reduction lipid lowering combination treatments are reserved for "high risk" groups is limited resources, not because of some terrible side effect load that's only acceptable in desperate cases, like chemotherapy.

If resources were unlimited, or costs were lower, many more people would be given this treatment to aggressively reduce LDL,, starting much earlier in life to avoid plaque accumulation from ever starting to begin with.

2024 Recommendations on the Optimal Use of Lipid-Lowering Therapy in Established Atherosclerotic Cardiovascular Disease and Following Acute Coronary Syndromes: A Position Paper of the International Lipid Expert Panel (ILEP) - Drugs

Atherosclerotic cardiovascular disease (ASCVD) and consequent acute coronary syndromes (ACS) are substantial contributors to morbidity and mortality across Europe. Fortunately, as much as two thirds of this disease’s burden is modifiable, in particular by lipid-lowering therapy (LLT). Current...

link.springer.com

 

[Wizbang]

Fairly sure you're at the "automatic qualifier" level at this point. Just mention to your doc you occasionally feel muscle soreness while exercising and would like to try Repatha as a substitute for the statin. Once you get it you can always add the statin (or another) back on. Once qualified you'll essentially be covered for this class of RNA modifying lipid meds forever.
....

Hey @Ghoul any tips for using those auto-pens? I have been on repatha/praluent and recently I began nicking vessels ALOT (now have two matching bruises on each quad) I was doing my stomach but was advised due to the amount of stretch mark/scars I have quads would likely be preferable.

 

[Ghoul]

Hey @Ghoul any tips for using those auto-pens? I have been on repatha/praluent and recently I began nicking vessels ALOT (now have two matching bruises on each quad) I was doing my stomach but was advised due to the amount of stretch mark/scars I have quads would likely be preferable.

I've come to the conclusion any area you can pinch subQ fat into a peak works*. This ensures sufficient depth for the needle (increasingly difficult with rHGH etching off subQ fat), particularly important for Repatha style pens, with that "collar" that has to be depressed to enable the button, you have to press so hard you may go IM unless you create the raised peak with a pinch.

*absorption timing differs a bit from location to location, so side effect prone drugs like GLPs may behave a bit differently from spot to spot (more or less worse sides from differing intensity of peak), and different lymph nodes are involved (potentially affecting injection site reactions and other side effects), but that's rabbit hole stuff, and TLDR any subQ will work, just having sufficient depth is what matters. You don't want it going partially into muscle or hitting veins.

 

[Wizbang]

I've come to the conclusion any area you can pinch subQ fat into a peak works*. This ensures sufficient depth for the needle (increasingly difficult with rHGH etching off subQ fat), particularly important for Repatha style pens, with that "collar" that has to be depressed to enable the button, you have to press so hard you may go IM unless you create the raised peak with a pinch.

*absorption timing differs a bit from location to location, so side effect prone drugs like GLPs may behave a bit differently from spot to spot (more or less worse sides from differing intensity of peak), and different lymph nodes are involved (potentially affecting injection site reactions and other side effects), but that's rabbit hole stuff, and TLDR any subQ will work, just having sufficient depth is what matters. You don't want it going partially into muscle or hitting veins.

Yeah the collar seems to be the tricky part. I will give other areas a go off the typical path

 

[Ghoul]

Yeah the collar seems to be the tricky part. I will give other areas a go off the typical path

And with only 1 or 2 pens a month for PCSK9 inhibitors, you REALLY don't want to fuck up that injection (though you can get replacement from manufacturer if you do).

Check this out for an example of how easy it is to screw up with collar style pens:


View: https://youtube.com/shorts/-6DEp45JEh4

 

[Banana Joe]

My cardiogolist prescribes anyone with LDL higher than 70 Ezemtibe right away, anything above 100 for him is already critical and thats where he throws Bempoic Acid on top it.

Currently trying to get Repatha through him too as my family history is fucked genetically speaking in the regards to LDL with markers over 300 running in the family and extremely low HDL (usually around 20-25)

I just checked how to get a prescription for Evolocumab where I live. I don't think I will be able to qualify. I know someone in the medical field, that mentioned a cardiologist who is apparently pretty generous with expensive examinations, I hope I can get at least heart MRT that way, without having to pay for it myself, as one has to, if there is no concrete indication for it.

Maybe that cardiologist can also be convinced to give Evolocumab, if I fake that I can't take any statins?
Will need a solid strategy for this, I guess....

 

[Banana Joe]

@ChemBB's heart attack gave me a bit of a scare. I have not read his post thoroughly yet, but I feel like there is quite a bit of similarity.

Now I am back wondering how to take that god damn Reta without killing my appetite. I guess part of me just doesn't want to miss out those miracle GLPS1-drugs...

 

[ChemBB]

Now I am back wondering how to take that god damn Reta without killing my appetite

Have you tried it before?

For a lot of people, it doesn't impact appetite much

I just had to add 1-2mg Sema to my 8mg Reta to curb how hungry I was getting at the end of the day, it was making it hard to sleep

 

[Banana Joe]

Have you tried it before?
For a lot of people, it doesn't impact appetite much

Yes, and just 1mg KILLED my appetite so effectively, I had to force myself to even drink enough.

And no, that was not nocebo, I have just become a really terrible eater over the last few years, started when I first got Covid (and lost and never fully regained my sense of smell and taste).
I can get by without eating the entire day, and even when I get hypo and get cold sweats, from going hypo, I don't get hungry.

 

[Ateam2023]

Yes, and just 1mg KILLED my appetite so effectively, I had to force myself to even drink enough.
And no, that was not nocebo, I have just become a really terrible eater over the last few years, started when I first got Covid (and lost and never fully regained my sense of smell and taste).

What dose of reta did you start out at at a curiosity?

 

[Banana Joe]

What dose of reta did you start out at at a curiosity?

.2mg e2d, stayed there for 10-14 days, then increased to .3mg e2d. I had already felt the decreased appetite, but a few days after I went to .3mg, it started to get really bad.

A friend of mine uses the same batch of Reta and tells me 2mg just curbs his appetite a bit.

 

[Ateam2023]

.2mg e2d, stayed there for 10-14 days, then increased to .3mg e2d. I had already felt the decreased appetite, but a few days after I went to .3mg, it started to get really bad.

A friend of mine uses the same batch of Reta and tells me 2mg just curbs his appetite a bit.

i just started @.5 mg Reta initially in one dose, this second week ima split and do .25 mg on Monday and same for Thursday, those are my Test c injection days anyway , besides daily hgh/peptides etc, but so far im on day 6 with just good initial response to Reta

 

[Banana Joe]

i just started @.5 mg Reta initially in one dose, this second week ima split and do .25 mg on Monday and same for Thursday, those are my Test c injection days anyway , besides daily hgh/peptides etc, but so far im on day 6 with just good initial response to Reta

I would not dare to do a single .5mg injection.
I know I am a retard for saying this, but wonder if I could take another drug like Cyproheptadine, to increase my appetite enough, so I can take 2mg (or more) of Reta...

The slowed down gastric emptying still doesn't make no sense to me for a BB. If I go full tilt, I have trouble digesting all my food fast enough already. I hate being full.