Absolutely. Soon as I get time I will gather them, black out the necessary info to put as an attachment.
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
[HPLC/MS] AP Test E + NPP
- Thread starter dmt31
- Start date
Boilermech
New Member
Yeah I wasn't referring to the data that came from AP. I was referring to the data from the lab analysis that is in process of be performed by an accredited lab. When I get that report back we will all know how it's dosed. At least for that batch.
LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HOW IS THAT!
Look this clown has ONLY posted narrative analyses on NPP, but only posted a real time HPLC on Benzyl Alcohol, which eluted at 2.5 min! (Oddly bc of it's polarity the retention time of BA typically EXCEEDS 20 min regardless of the solvents used, which in addition to many other STANDARDIZED HPLC criteria were not mentioned)
Narrative testing is worthless bc anyone with half a brain, a willingness to deceive others, (which is about EVERY UGL I'm aware of) and a Windows OS can post this nonsense.
Obviously these "results" are no better than the products this lab has been selling !
I would LIKE to believe the "experts" at Reditt would be even more critical of these tests than I have been!
dmt31
New Member
I don't disagree just thought it was interesting that AP would send that out to a reseller
When UGLs are involved, NOTHING surprises me anymore! Just follow the MONEY mate!
Fair BULLSHIT!
Try telling that to the multitudes that have been screwed by UGL! Never ever give these clowns a pass bc the minute we give an inch they WILL take a mile, guaranteed.
And regarding TRT TT levels it's very important your comparing apples to oranges bc most folk DO INDEED achieve a PEAK TT level at 8=10 times the dose.
So yea an UGL whose blood level reveal a peak TT of much less than an 8 fold increase, are almost always selling under dosed gear, AND HPLC results PROVE THAT FACT!
I_know_nothing
New Member
I agree that these results from the HPLC do not mean anything. The narrative testing as well could just be made in publisher. No idea what the hplc of the BA was far. it is not unheard of for BA to elute at 2.5 min, i think i've seen it elute around 3-4 minutes using reverse phase HPLC. i believe usually BA comes out at around 25-27 min. it would be useful if AP told us what methods they were using, and what are solvent A and B
I_know_nothing
New Member
@Dr JIM you're exhibiting the exact type of unfairness i am talking about. you point out that TRT have peak 8-10x but you ignore the TRT that only have 5-6x. you bring up that UGLs dont exceed 8x but you ignore the fact that there have been bloods in which UGLs do test over 8x. for fairness you need to look at all the results, it means not just picking and choosing what results to use because they justify your points. honest fucking scientists aint doing that shit. they're not picking and choosing the results that support their research and ignoring everything that doesn't.
underdosed UGL or not, that's not the issue im talking about. im talking about fair treatment. if TRT patients can end up with 5-6x blood levels why arent we calling out Watson and Bayer as underdosed? or is the pharmacy homebrewing and then throwing on the watson label, putting it the box, and resealing it?
underdosed UGL or not, that's not the issue im talking about. im talking about fair treatment. if TRT patients can end up with 5-6x blood levels why arent we calling out Watson and Bayer as underdosed? or is the pharmacy homebrewing and then throwing on the watson label, putting it the box, and resealing it?
Obviously an RP HPLC in many cases can and does "reverse" the elution times of many substances as seen on ST HPLC, but as I've already mentioned, NONE of the conventional HPLC running parameters are even listed for data interpretation.
So yea IMO reports of this nature are the "Swiss Cheese" of laboratory testing FULL OF HOLES, AND ESSENTIALLY WORTHLESS!
So yea IMO reports of this nature are the "Swiss Cheese" of laboratory testing FULL OF HOLES, AND ESSENTIALLY WORTHLESS!
I_know_nothing
New Member
100% agree with your first point. they need to give us parameters, solvents used, isocratic vs gradient, their dilutions, their sample size, we need all this info. and even with that we still need a standard to compare it to.
you obv know your shit dr. i know you've earned the respect of the members here. i wont disrespect you, but i have no problem stating the truth- just excuse my shitty language ha
Boilermech
New Member
Sounds like I_know_nothing is lying. Looks like he does know something. Well at least more than I know about this stuff. [emoji6]
Always nice to have more knowledgeable people here on Meso.
Just so you know Doc is definitely well respected here and it's deserved. Stick around and contribute brother. We can always use some more of you smart guys helping out.
I_know_nothing
New Member
haha i honestly dont that much! i've just worked hplc in the past, dont anymore so a little rusty now. AAS analysis is beyond my scope of knowledge but i believe there are some fundamental pieces of hplc knowledge that can be extrapolated.
ill try my best to contribute, im aware of the dr's reputation here- however that wont stop me from calling out anything i find fishy. he's deserved the rep and respect, but that doesnt mean he's immune to criticism and questioning, you would agree @Boilermech ?
Yea well if patients are ending up with PEAK TT levels drawn at 24-36 hours that are only 5-6 times the dose I've NOT SEEN IT.
And that is what the HPLC results reveal also.
I_know_nothing
New Member
I shill for no UGL, I couldn't give a damn about any UGL as I make my own and dont trust their dosing worth shit. however, what i do stand up for is fairness in this community. we're seeing too much heckling of these UGLs when you're not treating them fairly, just an example of the 10x dosing standard you hold UGLs up to when even Watson/Bayer don't hold up.
I personally know an individual who is on TRT 200mg once a week who levels are consistently around 1100-1400, I've asked him to dig up records of bloods if he can. there are individual in this very thread who say their TT levels are 5-7x range. also, it is to my knowledge that optimal blood draws for Test C is a little longer than 24-36. that time frame seems more appropriate for a sorter ester like test P.
HPLC or not, there are several conclusions you can draw:
1. users are lying about their low TT levels from Watson/Bayer or arent actually on pharma test
2. users are telling the truth about their low TT levels from Watson/Bayer, in which case, on this forum, Watson/Bayer are underdosed
3. this forum's ideal of 10x blood levels as standard is unrealistic
which conclusion do you feel applies? @Dr JIM
I_know_nothing
New Member
@jackmeoff1 as much as your username makes me a skeptic, could you post your previous blood results on TRT as well as a picture of your script as well as your pharma test?
A man of wisdom after only 7-8 posts here to protect all the unfairly treated UGL from Meso hecklers, LMAO
I_know_nothing
New Member
treat them like shit that's fine idc, but treat them fairly. if they're scamming or have shitty procedures ok fuck them up. but if their gear is coming up 6-8x and not your 10x standard when TRT comes up 6-7x, how exactly is that fair?
but i am not here to discuss the junior member status vs well known member status. i am here for discussion. i asked you to draw a conclusion, please address the question. do not pull the "im a higher member here so i dont have to answer to you". i asked a valid question and i would like your answer to that question.
I will
Boilermech
New Member
If we could get 7x to 8x from an UGL that has shown up here lately I think everyone would be ecstatic. Unfortunately we haven't been getting those numbers brother. There's no reason to get defensive about how we treat the labs here. You don't understand what has happened to several of our members here over the last couple years. And Dr. JIM is doing something about it. So instead of questioning him with an attitude you should show some respect.
I_know_nothing
New Member
@jackmeoff1 even if you just post your script (cover any IDing info) and watson photo right now it would give some you cred. too many times have we seen people say "yeah ill post bloods" for them to disappear
