How much of a caloric surplus when bulking on gear?

[Necessary Evil]

Tomorrow I finish my cut, and at Monday I will start my bulking cycle which will consist of:

• Testosterone Enanthate @250mg E3.5D; Duration Week 1-20.
• Deca Durabolin @250mg E3.5D; Duration Week 1-18.
• Dianabol @50mg ED; Duration Week 1-6.

Right now I diet at 2530 Kcal. My maintenance calories as of now, are 2845 Kcal. I was thinking of having a more slow and controlled approach into this bulk as a means to avoid excess fat gain. So, I was thinking of bulking at 3095 Kcal in order to gain 1.0% of BW per month. Do you think that I'm selling myself short with a 250 Kcal surplus? Do you think it's wise to add more calories? Keep in mind that recalibration of caloric intake will, of course, be manipulated by a biweekly or monthly basis.

 

[Sparkyp]

I watched this the other day. John meadows as we all know is the man.

 

[Neewbiest guy]

I watched this the other day. John meadows as we all know is the man.

I like the advice in this video on the 20% rule on calories.

 

[Mac11wildcat]

Didn’t watch vid, but IMO a constant 250cal surplus. That means add calories every time you see slowed/no progress in the mirror/scale.

Surpluses and deficits are not something you set at the beginning of a cut or bulk. Your dietary needs change as weight goes up or down and your body reaches homeostasis at a new caloric intake.

if you are no longer losing weight at your current caloric intake THAT IS YOUR MAINTENANCE LEVEL. Do not rely on calculators for this stuff. If you’ve been eating the same diet for a few weeks and nothing’s changed it is now your maintenance caloric level.

 

[Necessary Evil]

Didn’t watch vid, but IMO a constant 250cal surplus. That means add calories every time you see slowed/no progress in the mirror/scale.

Surpluses and deficits are not something you set at the beginning of a cut or bulk. Your dietary needs change as weight goes up or down and your body reaches homeostasis at a new caloric intake.

if you are no longer losing weight at your current caloric intake THAT IS YOUR MAINTENANCE LEVEL. Do not rely on calculators for this stuff. If you’ve been eating the same diet for a few weeks and nothing’s changed it is now your maintenance caloric level.

Thanks a lot for your answer.

That's exactly how I have it planned to be honest, so it's great that we are in agreeance. I got a couple more questions though, would be good if you could shed some light given that you obviously have tremendous experience both in nutrition and on drugs.

• How long would you wait to make caloric adjustments? For example, as you said, I will keep a constant 250Kcal caloric surplus, but given the fact that my cycle is quite 'wet'; especially since I will run Dianabol for the first 6 weeks it's only natural that I will gain loads of water weight. This will cause rapid weight gain. How do I know if I should add/remove calories? Should I just accept the possible water weight and adjust on a weekly basis for example?
• Since I like to keep data and I do daily weigh-ins; the previous week I lost 0.25kg. This week I expect something similar, must wait for tomorrow to have my weekly average though. Would you say that 2845 Kcal for maintenance is accurate? Or is my true maintenance calories even lower?

 

[Necessary Evil]

I watched this the other day. John meadows as we all know is the man.

I just watched the video. I can't say that I completely disagree with this; judging with what I know 20% to start with might be a little bit high? In my case, it's 568 Kcal and going straight to this wouldn't it cause a little bit of fat gain? The most I might consider having as a surplus would be 500 Kcal but only when Deca saturates [so about 4th-6th week]. As for now, I do believe that going slow should be the wisest decision.

I'm expecting more people to hop in and share their opinion!

 

[Sparkyp]

I just watched the video. I can't say that I completely disagree with this; judging with what I know 20% to start with might be a little bit high? In my case, it's 568 Kcal and going straight to this wouldn't it cause a little bit of fat gain? The most I might consider having as a surplus would be 500 Kcal but only when Deca saturates [so about 4th-6th week]. As for now, I do believe that going slow should be the wisest decision.

I'm expecting more people to hop in and share their opinion!

Like @Mac11wildcat said I don’t think there’s a set amount.
This seems like a goo baseline. And TBH. Before watching this video I always thought “more food meant more gains” which it appears is not the case. Maybe A simple 15-20% increase might be enough. Found this interesting.

 

[Btcowboy]

Agree with @Mac11wildcat as well. 250 calorie surplus to start and adjust from there. I don't always practice that method and usually regret it lol

 

[johntt44]

It's not the same for everyone.Some people need more of a jump than others before they start putting on weight.

 

[Btcowboy]

It's not the same for everyone.Some people need more of a jump than others before they start putting on weight.

I guess more of a good place to start if your unsure where to start. Everyone is different though

 

[Sparkyp]

It's not the same for everyone.Some people need more of a jump than others before they start putting on weight.

Def. you look at some of the big boys in our industry like Shaw and thor and these guys are like 10k a day or something.
I guess it all depends on what your going for.

I know if I hover around 3k cal, 230 P, 350 carbs I’m jumping from 209lbs to 230lbs in a few months. Right now I’m at 2400 cal, 190-210g protein 250-300g carbs and I’m stagnant at 209lbs. That’s with cardio and weight training. Like @Mac11wildcat said this is probably my baseline.

Trying to get down ton13-15% BF. Once there (hopefully within a year) I want to bulk with the 20% suggestion. I’m personally sick of bulking with 20% body fat. I just end up looking like a high school offensive lineman

 

[johntt44]

I used one of those tdee calculators and typed in "very active". It gave me 4100 cals maintenance. I just kept going up until I started gaining weight. I hit 5200 before I saw any change.

 

[Neewbiest guy]

I used one of those tdee calculators and typed in "very active". It gave me 4100 cals maintenance. I just kept going up until I started gaining weight. I hit 5200 before I saw any change.

Jebus, what are your stats? I consume around 3400 a day. I'm 6'2" 180lbs

 

[Sparkyp]

I used one of those tdee calculators and typed in "very active". It gave me 4100 cals maintenance. I just kept going up until I started gaining weight. I hit 5200 before I saw any change.

theres no way your eating that in chicken and rice. lol i struggle to hit 2400 caloried eating chicken and rice 5x a day or whatever

what does your eating schedule and type of calories look like? mostly red meat? fast food? ice cream?

 

[johntt44]

3.5lbs ground sirloin, 10+cups jasmine rice, 3-4 cans veggies, 2-3pcs fruit and bone broth mixed in with the meat/rice. A couple of cut up bell peppers in the meat too.