Cycle Recommendation / Hematocrit

[BumpassHell]

I'm actually angry at myself for spoon feeding you after your ridiculously dense comment, despite me sincerely trying to contribute to the discussion and pointing you towards an entire discussion on it. You're also a Google search away from the answer.

That said - Look at the data for yourself. Placebo -> +.5% hematocrit, treatment -> -1.1%, a 1.6% drop that was consistent across the entire population, and a 1.8% difference in red blood cells. Extrapolated from unhealthy older people (these groups) to folks on gear, that could be a larger 2-4% change.

Also, fuck you for that comment.

Thank you. So there's one study that suggests: "Small changes in hematocrit and erythrocyte levels were observed during the study; these changes were to a similar degree as seen with hemoglobin, with a mean change from baseline at week 4 of –1.1% (bempedoic acid) vs 0.5% (placebo) in hematocrit levels and –1.8% (bempedoic acid) vs –0.01% (placebo) in erythrocytes".

Is there any other data or is that the only study?

 

[Sicsemptyran]

I have it on deck to add to my pita and Zetia. Very interested to see if I get this effect as well.

Do report back! Would love to hear how it works for you.

 

[Sicsemptyran]

Thank you. So there's one study that suggests: "Small changes in hematocrit and erythrocyte levels were observed during the study; these changes were to a similar degree as seen with hemoglobin, with a mean change from baseline at week 4 of –1.1% (bempedoic acid) vs 0.5% (placebo) in hematocrit levels and –1.8% (bempedoic acid) vs –0.01% (placebo) in erythrocytes".

Is there any other data or is that the only study?

Going to spoon feed one last time and then will cease responding to you. I enjoyed your new member introduction and it’s sorry to see that after such a thorough and well written introduction, you’re choosing to be a prick for little reason.

That “one study” you’re looking at is a pooled analysis of 4 separate clinical trials, encompassing 3621 patients.

I’m not suggesting anything as fact, I’m not paid to convince you. I’m presenting something I noticed that seems more clearly evident and studied with data than many of the things you or I have injected, including every AAS besides Test, and most peptides (BPC/TB/GHK/etc). If that’s not enough evidence for you, it’s hilarious that you have used all of those per your new member introduction.

 

[BumpassHell]

Going to spoon feed one last time and then will cease responding to you. I enjoyed your new member introduction and it’s sorry to see that after such a thorough and well written introduction, you’re choosing to be a prick for little reason.

That “one study” you’re looking at is a pooled analysis of 4 separate clinical trials, encompassing 3621 patients.

I’m not suggesting anything as fact, I’m not paid to convince you. I’m presenting something I noticed that seems more clearly evident and studied with data than many of the things you or I have injected, including every AAS besides Test, and most peptides (BPC/TB/GHK/etc). If that’s not enough evidence for you, it’s hilarious that you have used all of those per your new member introduction.

I think that folks should be able to present the data that informs their assertions, or otherwise explain why they feel the way they do. If you feel differently, that's fine. I'm genuinely curious about your claims. You seem pretty sensitive about me asking. That's not a "me" problem; that's a "you" problem. I don't really care, so please carry on with whatever you have going on and don't feel the need to respond to me.

 

[trtbuilder]

Going to spoon feed one last time and then will cease responding to you. I enjoyed your new member introduction and it’s sorry to see that after such a thorough and well written introduction, you’re choosing to be a prick for little reason.

That “one study” you’re looking at is a pooled analysis of 4 separate clinical trials, encompassing 3621 patients.

I’m not suggesting anything as fact, I’m not paid to convince you. I’m presenting something I noticed that seems more clearly evident and studied with data than many of the things you or I have injected, including every AAS besides Test, and most peptides (BPC/TB/GHK/etc). If that’s not enough evidence for you, it’s hilarious that you have used all of those per your new member introduction.

He asked a nice enough question and you're being a condescending douchebag. Nobody respects people who act like you.

Congrats on your life changing observation though. Hopefully your mommy put a gold star on the fridge in recognition.

 

[Sicsemptyran]

He asked a nice enough question and you're being a condescending douchebag. Nobody respects people who act like you.

“So there’s no data to back your claim?” In response to linking to an entire discussion about it talking about the clinical trial data is a disingenuous question. Or just very poor communication and an internet misunderstanding. If it’s the latter, then sorry to him for coming on hot.

Either way, most normal people will read that as a “so you’re just making shit up?”, which given the entire write up and long discussion I linked going into the clinical trial data with much back & forth from many individuals, yes, would of course rub me the wrong way.

 

[trtbuilder]

“So there’s no data to back your claim?” In response to linking to an entire discussion about it talking about the clinical trial data is a disingenuous question. Or just very poor communication and an internet misunderstanding. If it’s the latter, then sorry to him for coming on hot.

Either way, most normal people will read that as a “so you’re just making shit up?”, which given the entire write up and long discussion I linked going into the clinical trial data with much back & forth from many individuals, yes, would of course rub me the wrong way.

Yeah, maybe get your roid rage in check. You're not winning anyone over.

 

[RockyP]

Just wanted to add to this topic that when I started TRT I was powerlifter fat and had high hct (52-54). Fast forward to the end of a 50 pound cutting phase, my androgen load went up 5x (at its peak), and my H/H are now both in normal ranges. The other huge change was consistently using my CPAP for treatment of severe osa during this time. While there are always some guys who will struggle with hct levels I would strongly urge everyone to:

1. Get evaluated for OSA even if you’re not big / fat
2. Be honest with yourself about your body fat levels and cardio fitness. Do LISS / get
Your 10k steps even if you have to drag yourself. Do it daily.

 

[oldage]

If you want to help prevent a rise in levels of RBC / HCT you should look into 140mg 3x/day of silymarin. (Milk thistle extract) This is for prevention, a proactive step. It will NOT lower RBC / HCT. To over simplify, your blood iorn will go through a process of chelation binding it up for removal. This assumes u have healthy iorn/ferritin levels as this is a requirement to make healthy blood cells and HCT causing a rise from PED use.

Plus milk thistle is often used to promote liver health.

The other meds mentioned, u may or may not need for their intended purposes but as a by product of using them MAY be able to help reduce RBC / HCT.

Never a good idea to donate blood as it usually causes a vicious cycle of lowering ferritn just to get a short term temporary reduction. Still requiring further donations and ultimately an unsustainable level of low iorn/ferritin.

Happened to me on my first donation. And RBC / HCT came right back up supplementing with iorn while ferritin remained super low, single digits.

Best bet is to stop or lower the PED. You'll learn which PED's you can and can not use.

Takes 120 days for RBC / HCT to naturally start to come down. Blood life cycle

 

[superbigcalve]

Hello everyone
I am in search of knowledge from more experienced people than I. Currently 25 and on TRT, been doing a ton of research on doing a safe successful cycle. I’ll be honest I’ve gotten ahead of myself and I have a ton of Test Cyp / NPP / Primo and a few other orals. In addition to a ton of ancillaries and supps. But going to pump the brakes for a minute as much as I want to try all of this shit. Is the general consensus still on the good old 400-500mg test for 16 weeks? Would be very interested in what your guys thoughts might be. Also would love to know the cycles some guys have ran what’s been the worst for your RBC / HCT count. I’ve been rather obsessed in the pursuit of controlling hematocrit as I despise giving blood ( seems there’s mixed thoughts on tha anyway). But any advice you guys have is much appreciated.

There are a few basics you can do to prevent Hema to spice they are easy to follow like.
-Drinking more fluid
-Doing your Cardio
-Geting enough electrolytes
-Checking your sleep

in case of AAS sure bolde is known for driving hema high, but thats also a genetic factor i know people running 800 bolde and have normal hema levels.

So my advise would be taking blood before you start running your cycle to check how your base hema level is (some have high levels as nattys to)

Then start with you lowesd dose and simply work your way up, draw blood to check when the turning point comes. This is you base dose. And then stick to that, the best cycle is the one you can run for long time without any major side effects, for example i can run around 600test a week without any issues as i go above this hema starts to rise.

So i stick to my sweetspot by 500 test and then adding some mast or npp on top, until i have my full cycle, sure its more work than just go for it but in that case you will learn a lot about your body and we all know health is wealth.

When it comes to supplements, nattokinase, serapeptase and 1 octasonol help with hema.

Take care