Sicsemptyran
Member
I took him to mean zero drugs vs drugs - In which case I totally get it but couldn’t agree more with your point.
Going from natural to 300mg a week was game-changing, but 300mg -> 600mg is an infinitely smaller boost.
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Anyone else come to the realization that the drugs are literally 90% of the equation and it bums you out?
- Thread starter jtmarlin
- Start date
Going from natural to 300mg a week was game-changing, but 300mg -> 600mg is an infinitely smaller boost.
shredded.lyfe
Member
Yep and my natural T was always floating around the bottom of the reference range.
I know nattys with effectively no testosterone that are stronger and look better then these mongaloids blasting grams of pharmaceuticals.
They're just junkies man, excited to pin and that's it, they actually don't care about the results.
bananafeet
Member
View: https://youtu.be/TLDkty94RGA
Rippetoe answered this quite nicely. Unfortunately he's right.
They are just another tool, albeit a powerful one.
All the guys who say steroids/drugs are everything are usually dead. The guys who say it's genetic/training are usually still alive.
so let's do an exercise... at "abs visible" 12% bodyfat at 5'9 and 90kg (198lbs) you have 174 pounds of fat free mass
at 7% bodyfat you are 187 pounds meaning you are claiming to have enough muscle natty to stand onstage next to a men's physique IFBB PRO and look like you belong without drugs
ok
shredded.lyfe
Member
I have visible abs at 15% bodyfat because im not a low level bodybuilder and i actually move serious weight because im a national level athlete in both powerlifting and strongman.
Try again retard.
That's 100 percent true and I agree. I was talking about no drugs vs drugs or low level TRT (75-100mg) vs actual cycling. Even low level TRT vs no drugs is night and day in my experience.
Genetics are the biggest factor when it comes to bodybuilder
most top Olympians looked liked they were on gear when they were natural
compared to someone like Bostin Loyd who took ridiculous amounts claiming it was all drugs yet he couldn't get his pro card. By his logic he should have been mr.olympia (yes I know he said alot of this stuff just for views)
most top Olympians looked liked they were on gear when they were natural
compared to someone like Bostin Loyd who took ridiculous amounts claiming it was all drugs yet he couldn't get his pro card. By his logic he should have been mr.olympia (yes I know he said alot of this stuff just for views)
Duck Dodgers
New Member
They are 90% of the ‘bodybuilding’ look, but they are not 90% of the entire endeavor
Like many have said, I am sure we all know a guy who was on grams of stuff and looked like shit.
We also know dudes who were natural, and looked better than the dude waddling around the gym flaunting GASP apparel
Drugs push your physique to otherwise impossible standards. But without proper training, sleep, hydration, and nutrition, it doesn’t really matter what drugs you’re on .
Genetics are the biggest factor. I know people personally who have made strides in their physique AFTER they reduced their drug load. They fixed their training and diet. These are people who are competitive bodybuilders
All factors of bodybuilding are importsnt. Steroids play a necessary role, but they are not 90%. Each aspect of bodybuilding is vital, really.
But to your point, yes natural bodybuilding is a joke. I did my first show in 2020 natural, and I wasn’t even peeled at 148lbs and 5’7. If I was peeled I’m sure I would’ve been maybe 140.
Just the way it is. There’s nothing ‘natural’ about bodybuilding. Natural bodybuilding is an oxymoron lmao
Like many have said, I am sure we all know a guy who was on grams of stuff and looked like shit.
We also know dudes who were natural, and looked better than the dude waddling around the gym flaunting GASP apparel
Drugs push your physique to otherwise impossible standards. But without proper training, sleep, hydration, and nutrition, it doesn’t really matter what drugs you’re on .
Genetics are the biggest factor. I know people personally who have made strides in their physique AFTER they reduced their drug load. They fixed their training and diet. These are people who are competitive bodybuilders
All factors of bodybuilding are importsnt. Steroids play a necessary role, but they are not 90%. Each aspect of bodybuilding is vital, really.
But to your point, yes natural bodybuilding is a joke. I did my first show in 2020 natural, and I wasn’t even peeled at 148lbs and 5’7. If I was peeled I’m sure I would’ve been maybe 140.
Just the way it is. There’s nothing ‘natural’ about bodybuilding. Natural bodybuilding is an oxymoron lmao
Andrewthatguy
Member
Look this isn’t personal at all. Something I noticed about lots of natural bodybuilders that decide to step on stage is that they do that waaaaaayyyyyy too early. Again, when it comes to how much lean muscle mass your body can carry, that has nothing to do with genetics.
Plenty of naturals can get to 170-180 lean, even with sub par genetics. Genetics have way more to do with the look and insertions than how much muscle mass you can carry on your body.
Duck Dodgers
New Member
I’m sure I could’ve, but honestly yeah fuck that lmao. I definitely did it to get my feet wet, kind of thing. So I sure do agree
At 5'7 stage lean 170-180 is not happening naturally except in very extreme circumstances. Philip Ricardo Jr WON his last Natural Mr. Olympia at 5'9 175. Now can natty look halfway decent at 5'9 175, sure but he is going to have to do lighting tricks etc to look ripped IME.
Andrewthatguy
Member
Yeah I agree, but stage lean at weights between 135-145, shit even 150, you shouldn’t even be competing at that point. Me personally, if I’m going to compete, I’m going to compete to win, and do everything in my power to win.
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