Ateam2023
Member
1 vial of @TheLobster orange top hgh from the july promo,, 
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Post up your Natty IGF-1 Level
- Thread starter malfeasance
- Start date
Proud Pangolin
Member
Thanks, very interesting. So theoretically young people can get the most anabolism out of very high igf-1 levels mit minimal risks for acromegaly?
explodingHeart
Member
I'm 40 and using any sort of GH shoots my RHR like 10-15 points. I can have a low BP on deca and tren but injecting GH is like injecting pure liquid meth.
However, great for dieting while in single digit BF.
In your opinion. probably a bad idea to use large doses over 40? Is 1-2 iu safe?
Proud Pangolin
Member
Ok so we have normation problem meaning the samplesize isnt big enough to get an actual represtation of the populatiom and therefore the standarddeviation (SD) or to be more accurate the absolute numbers are very large.
Normal range should typically be +/- 1 SD which would include 68% of the population or 2 SD meaning 95% assuming its a normal distribution.
If the sample is to small the absoolute numbers and therefore the absolute range will be a lot larger.
I don't know about minimal risk, but youth is better for anabolism generally. How that relates to exogenous HGH use is also another kettle of fish. Young people with great IGF levels may do well avoiding HGH, not because of acromegaly, but other comorbid conditions that may arise with GH excess.
Yes, smaller sample sizes tend to widen confidence intervals for the true values of population measurements/parameters.
However, biology is funny. The wide range itself might be a true natural phenomenon...
If it was narrower though we might have seen more incidences of acromegaly presenting for treatment even if the patient denies hgh use. (speculation on my part). (The problem of acromegaly is not just the bony changes. There are a lot of systemic and multi organ disorders that will force a hospital visit)
So leaving all the other things aside, my take home is that:
1) people with acromegaly tend to have higher levels of IGF-1,
2) researchers based on available data have guidelines on IGF levels to medicate those on therapy with a goal of avoiding acromegaly or other unwanted effects.
3) We can use these guidelines to stay safe. Some can also skirt it and escape the consequences, come here and post about it, and it may be a true reflection based on where they fall in the (unknown) true distribution, despite how such posts may infuriate people. Arguing with them by throwing what is currently known therefore, will be at odds with their experience..
Some of us for example had better IGF on (dodgy QSC) Tesamorelin and CJC/IPA and lower IGF on 3IU QSC HGH. It may be bunk GH, it may be individual respose to IGF, it maybe blood vs muscle IGF level disparity, it may even be other issues like lack of rest, how GH is being dosed in relation to eating habits, or it may be age.. e.t.c
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Ghoul
Member
That is what the evidence suggests and in cases of GH deficiency, doctors target IGF in the upper end of the age range limit, and thats for life. It's very reasonable to say you could go as high as 1.3x the upper limit of normal IGF for many years without acromegaly risk. 1 to 1.3x is where doctors begin looking for issues with your pituitary, but doesn't trigger IGF lowering treatment. 1.5x is the absolute lowest IGF associated with acromegaly symptoms.
malfeasance
Member
Well, we have all seen young professional bodybuilders look drastically different in the face while still at a young age . . .
AlexDavis43
Member
Safe, sure
But not really sure what benefits you'd get from 1-2 IU/d if any (satisfy the FOMO itch?)
Proud Pangolin
Member
But if hogh amounts of igf-1 receptors mean that in young people the same amount of igf-1 wont result in acromegaly like in older people not only does this mean that igf-1 is more anabolic for them but also parallel the risks of acromegaly are lower
Proud Pangolin
Member
I will actually do some bloddwork this summer and see what my igf-1 level on 3x daily CJC no dac and GHRP-2 is as i have the feeling it will be higher than on 4 IU of GH.Yes, smaller sample sizes tend to widen confidence intervals for the true values of population measurements/parameters.
However, biology is funny. The wide range itself might be a true natural phenomenon...
If it was narrower though we might have seen more incidences of acromegaly presenting for treatment even if the patient denies hgh use. (speculation on my part). (The problem of acromegaly is not just the bony changes. There are a lot of systemic and multi organ disorders that will force a hospital visit)
So leaving all the other things aside, my take home is that:
1) people with acromegaly tend to have higher levels of IGF-1,
2) researchers based on available data have guidelines on IGF levels to medicate those on therapy with a goal of avoiding acromegaly or other unwanted effects.
3) We can use these guidelines to stay safe. Some can also skirt it and escape the consequences, come here and post about it, and it may be a true reflection based on where they fall in the (unknown) true distribution, despite how such posts may infuriate people. Arguing with them by throwing what is currently known therefore, will be at odds with their experience..
Some of us for example had better IGF on (dodgy QSC) Tesamorelin and CJC/IPA and lower IGF on 3IU QSC HGH. It may be bunk GH, it may be individual respose to IGF, it maybe blood vs muscle IGF level disparity, it may even be other issues like lack of rest, how GH is being dosed in relation to eating habits, or it may be age.. e.t.c
Just how i feel however to be faire i only ran once 4 IUs for 6 weeks which may not be enough to raise igf-1. On the other hand same goes for peptides.
Proud Pangolin
Member
For example? ( Im not questioning it im just truly curious as everybody is talking about GH-head but besides examples like Stallon i rarly see any pictures. And with stallon, well aging is a confunding variable)
I was just trying to point out that there are other possibilities to worry about. There are more rapidly proliferating cells in youth that should be allowed to die out in apoptosis.. GH can prolong the life span of these cells or make them multiply more rapidly.. causing a host of issues, from developing larger organs, to stimulating tumors and cancers, to even messing up other hormones. These things are just as common as acromegaly..
It may also down regulate natural hgh production and if the dose is lower than the boost the natural HGH gives them, they're short-changing themselves.
songsofpyramids
Member
This is dreaming.
sionnach
Banned
Clappincheeks
Member
Ateam2023
Member
jfc man, that is really high, how much ius are you doing? Probably a "good responder" i take it,,
I dunno man..
. Personally did a High dose CJC experiment. Ramped up slowly to 1mg all the way to 2mg CJC/day, and IGF went up after 2 weeks.It was meant to be a short term experiment cos It's not financially sound. Switched to GH now IGF is tanking at 3IU
Clappincheeks
Member
Currently 6 units and yes great responder. I've always seen good results with IGF1 I need to do GH serum next time thoughjfc man, that is really high, how much ius are you doing? Probably a "good responder" i take it,,
Ghoul
Member
Consider having Free IGF-1 or if not available, IGFBP-3 & 1 tested.
Total IGF can be deceptive.
"Super responders", may actually have high levels of IGF binding protein, and because that prevents IGF from attaching to receptors and functioning, it doesn't get utilized, building up in blood giving the false impression of GH giving a good result when it's not. If IGFBP is high, then you can take steps to lower it, freeing up biologically active IGF, and actually get better results.
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