Protein while cutting?

[Arcânn]

I know this is probably a highly debated topic, but I want to be smart (at the expense of postponing my first cycle) and drop some fat first since I'm probably 14-16% if I had to guess. So I'm planning to start natty cutting first. I'm wanting to know how much protein is generally needed to cut and maintain as much lean mass as possible. I hear 1.5-2g/lb of body weight thrown around a lot but I also hear lower numbers too. I would just like some input on this.

I'll likely throw clen in the mix since it seems to help at least a little with muscle preservation. I could care less about burning fat faster. As an ectomorph, my struggle will be more along the lines of not losing too much weight too quickly.

 

[Eman]

1gr per lb of bodyweight.

You can eat more for satiety if you want, or if you just like more protein...

 

[Arcânn]

Oh! I thought it'd be much higher. I've been eating slightly higher than that for bulking. I'm guessing the higher amounts are for guys who are already very far ahead of their natural limits?

 

[barneys]

In terms of maximum muscle preservation, 1g per pound of bodyweight would be sufficient. But on a cut, you will be hungry as fuck, so eating 1.5g- 2g of protein per pound of bodyweight will lessen hunger and make it feel less like "dieting"

 

[Genghis K.]

Consuming 2 grams of protein per pound of body weight daily is much harder than most realize. Get at least 1 gram in when cutting or bulking, preferably a bit more.

 

[barneys]

Consuming 2 grams of protein per pound of body weight daily is much harder than most realize. Get at least 1 gram in when cutting or bulking, preferably a bit more.

Very true, I personally aim for 150g per day when bulking and 170g per day when cutting.. Ultra high protein diets have been shown in studies to have a negligible impact in terms of increased gains.

 

[Eman]

Oh! I thought it'd be much higher. I've been eating slightly higher than that for bulking. I'm guessing the higher amounts are for guys who are already very far ahead of their natural limits?

I think a more is better approach is usually taken, often unnecessary too.

Increased protein synthesis from AAS can be a good reason to bump the intake up ever so slightly. However, during a growth phase, if you're eating 2gr/lb of bodyweight and eating in a significant surplus to build muscle tissue... You're really going to start fighting an uphill battle. Carbs and fats are much easier sources of calories, keeping protein somewhat moderate will help you in the long run.

With all of that said, I think the gram per pound rule of thumb can also get skewed when you're a tall skinny guy trying to get bigger... For example, if you're 130lbs and +6' I wouldn't necessarily recommend you only eat 130-150gr of protein.

 

[Necessary Evil]

2.3-2.8g/kg should suffice for cutting. Keep in mind that when cutting protein needs go up.

 

[brutus79]

2.3-2.8g/kg should suffice for cutting. Keep in mind that when cutting protein needs go up.

That is absolutely ridiculous. You are trying to tell me I have to eat 600+ grams of protein in a cut? Please. I know why you look sickly in your photo- your kidneys are failing from excessive protein.

Anything higher than 1.5 grams is useless. There are plenty of studies and anecdotal experience testifying to this... boosting protein high on a cut is just lazy dieting. Carbs and fats along with protein need to be kept below the tdee and meal timing is key as well. The easiest way to lose fat? Up cardio. Hiit on the regular will set you up just fine

 

[Necessary Evil]

That is absolutely ridiculous. You are trying to tell me I have to eat 600+ grams of protein in a cut? Please. I know why you look sickly in your photo- your kidneys are failing from excessive protein.

Anything higher than 1.5 grams is useless. There are plenty of studies and anecdotal experience testifying to this... boosting protein high on a cut is just lazy dieting. Carbs and fats along with protein need to be kept below the tdee and meal timing is key as well. The easiest way to lose fat? Up cardio. Hiit on the regular will set you up just fine

Read what I wrote slowly and carefully, then reply.

Hint, I said per kg not lb.

Also there are diets like the lean gains method which you have to eat 60% of your calories from protein and science support them a lot, have not used them myself there are others here in Meso who did though.

 

[tengtren]

Ok my belief is when cutting what is the MAIN goal? Obviously reducing fat, and PRESERVE muscle tissue while we do this. Carbs fats AND protein can be converted into energy (all through different ways but it does happen)

I always believe in cut you must only eat amount protein to preserve what you have and have the least amount possible protein be converted to be used as energy otherwise it just seems like wasted calories to be eating anything above this. When bulking this doesn't matter obviously, so the amount you need I never though there was a 1/lb 1.2/lb .75/lb it will always be individual and is up to you or your coach to figure that out

There's also the school where you INCREASE everything you, which increases your metabolism as well and seems very effective but I have not used this on myself so can't really say much about it

 

[brutus79]

Kilogram is for drugs... not people. Get it right buddy.

Read what I wrote slowly and carefully, then reply.

Hint, I said per kg not lb.

Also there are diets like the lean gains method which you have to eat 60% of your calories from protein and science support them a lot, have not used them myself there are others here in Meso who did though.

 

[Eman]

Also there are diets like the lean gains method which you have to eat 60% of your calories from protein and science support them a lot, have not used them myself there are others here in Meso who did though.

I don't think anyone is implying that couldn't work... Hell, you could get 100% of your macros from protein and lose fat, but why do that when you can eat carbs and fats from foods you like and still get great results?

 

[Necessary Evil]

Kilogram is for drugs... not people. Get it right buddy.

What the actual fuck?

I don't think anyone is implying that couldn't work... Hell, you could get 100% of your macros from protein and lose fat, but why do that when you can eat carbs and fats from foods you like and still get great results?

I know. Generally, I'm an advocate of a normal balanced diet. As far as I know every time that it's compared with other type of diets the results show negligible differences in the broad spectrum.

It all boils down to personal preference in the end.

 

[Dr JIM]

2.3-2.8g/kg should suffice for cutting. Keep in mind that when cutting protein needs go up.

The problem w posts like the OPs, i“cutting” is undefined.

Yet since the bottom line for most is a significant decline in total BODY FAT, the focus should remain a reduction in dietary FAT
while escalating those activities that “burn” fat, as in EXERCISE, esp aerobic.

And providing a positive nitrogen balance is achieved, a drastic increase in protein intake will NOT force SKM anabolism absent the influence of PEDs.


Jim

 

[Dr JIM]

It all boils down to personal preference in the end.

Please let’s depart from the everyone is different form of opinion based logic that has become like a PED forum cancer., bc ALL share certain metabolic pathways that have a much greater impact on results than that of personal preference.

 

[Munky]

I gram of protein is usually around 4 calories, 100grams is about 400calories

 

[Mac11wildcat]

Ah. Diets. More contentious than drug protocols.

I had thought there was some study done regarding each macro and it’s availability (or ease of use) for energy by the body. I had thought protein was the least efficient pathway to cellular energy, meaning the body would prefer stored or consumed carbs and fats before looking for energy from proteins. I could be misremembering. What I believe, anecdotally, is you’ll see better body comp results if you error on higher protein vs erring on higher carbs or fats when holding cals constant.

Given my experiences, I have a hard time agreeing with all calories being created equal when it comes to body composition (not just weight loss itself, that’s much more simple).

What I think is most important as far as results goes (tossing aside any health considerations) is your ability to adhere to the diet. If 2000cals is a caloric deficit for you and eating 500g of protein is what you stick to, shit’ll work. Optimal? No. But most people never get the shot at optimal because they fuck their diets up by not adhering.

But as far as tissue preservation, 1g/lb may even be high, though safe. Do some reading on Alan Aragon’s studies and articles. He covers this extensively.

 

[maxmuscle01]

I like taking in a lot more protein when dropping body fat than I consume when bulking. I take 400g protein at weighing around 200lbs (cutting), when I bulk I take around 300-325grams. I increase cardio and eat carbs from vegetables and fruits mainly which completely lowers my calories. That’s the reason I increase protein during cutting. This is the simple answer for myself.