WWB 10iu Blue Top HGH - Serum Bloods

[ChemBB]

Here are my results. Protocol was 10iu pinned IM in delt, 3hr before blood draw:



For comparison, JY Pharma 24iu kits were 17.8 for 10iu same protocol (15% lower)

 

[Ghoul]

Thanks for the comparison, otherwise WWB was looking a bit weak, but it may be your physiology.

Do you have IGF from while on JY?

 

[ChemBB]

Thanks for the comparison, otherwise WWB was looking a bit weak, but it may be your physiology.

Do you have IGF from while on JY?

It's definitely my physiology. I have IGF-1 from both, something is going on weird with my hormones/metabolism.

I'm pretty sure it's because my leptin is still crushed to 0.3 (it went down another 0.1 since I posted the thread about it)

IGF-1 = 125, was 132 on JY. Both down from 137 before starting GH...

Been thinking of trying to see an endo about this, but I doubt they'll have much more of a clue.

 

[Ghoul]

I may have forgotten it from before, are you in a caloric deficit or extremely lean?

 

[ChemBB]

I may have forgotten it from before, are you in a caloric deficit or extremely lean?

I just came off of a 6 month calorie deficit with very high multi-GLP1 use.

DEXA scan showed ~9%

 

[Lilpiggy]

What’s the ideal GH reference range for quality HGH?

 

[Ghoul]

I just came off of a 6 month calorie deficit with very high multi-GLP1 use.

DEXA scan showed ~9%
View attachment 358350

Impressive!

So there’s your answer. Leptin doing what it does. Telling the liver you’re starving don’t waste energy growing.

“Acquired GH Resistance”

Same reason AIDS wasting patients need those huge Serostim doses.

Low Leptin also triggers increased GH binding protein production. Reducing GH half life from 3-4 hours to 1-2, so it’s cleared quickly explaining the low GH numbers an hour after injection.

Looks like a serious week long refeed (like 75% above maintenance) or longer with less surplus calories should normalize Leptin levels, Carbs are better for this purpose, then you could return to maintainance calories.

“GH dominance” continues to metabolize fat (lowering Leptin further), conserves glucose (fatigue and insulin resistance), creates an anti-anabolic environment, and worsens all typical GH sides like carpal.

Going to start monitoring Leptin whenever getting IGF checked now too because of your experience….

 

[ChemBB]

Looks like a serious week long refeed (like 75% above maintenance) or longer with less surplus calories should normalize Leptin levels, Carbs are better for this purpose, then you could return to maintainance calories.

The bloods where my leptin dropped from 0.4 -> 0.3 were actually after taking vacation + consuming massive calorie surplus and not exercising much.

So, I think leptin dysregulation is probably a several-week to several-month thing to fix, unfortunately =/

I'll be getting bloods in another 3-4 weeks to prove/disprove whether Nandrolone aromatizes (running 1.2g Nand solo) and I'll re-check then

 

[Vibora]

Impressive!

So there’s your answer. Leptin doing what it does. Telling the liver you’re starving don’t waste energy growing.

“Acquired GH Resistance”

Same reason AIDS wasting patients need those huge Serostim doses.

Low Leptin also triggers increased GH binding protein production. Reducing GH half life from 3-4 hours to 1-2, so it’s cleared quickly explaining the low GH numbers an hour after injection.

Looks like a serious week long refeed (like 75% above maintenance) or longer with less surplus calories should normalize Leptin levels, Carbs are better for this purpose, then you could return to maintainance calories.

“GH dominance” continues to metabolize fat (lowering Leptin further), conserves glucose (fatigue and insulin resistance), creates an anti-anabolic environment, and worsens all typical GH sides like carpal.

Going to start monitoring Leptin whenever getting IGF checked now too because of your experience….

Do GLP's medications effect this in any way?
The hunger signalling (or lack thereof) modulates Leptin levels if I'm not mistaken so using HGH whilst say using Reta will result in higher leptin levels than if you were to have the same cal deficit without using Reta...

 

[Ghoul]

Do GLP's medications effect this in any way?
The hunger signalling (or lack thereof) modulates Leptin levels if I'm not mistaken so using HGH whilst say using Reta will result in higher leptin levels than if you were to have the same cal deficit without using Reta...

GLPs usually make Leptin go down, because of fat loss.

But GLP’s also increase leptin sensitivity.

Assuming weight (and therefore leptin) is stable, studies show GLPs can increase IGF-1 20-40% (at the same leptin level) by restoring Leptin sensitivity. Up to 80% in someone who was formerly obese (and presumably has a lot of Leptin resistance). Significant improvement in IGF within a couple of weeks after starting GLP, max improvement in studies seen around 12 weeks. But keep in mind this effect is probably masked by weight loss occurring at the same time. Leptin levels drop but sensitivity improves, so IGF doesn’t move.

It may help explain why even current gen GLPs seem to retain muscle better than weight loss without them.

 

[ChemBB]

studies show GLPs can increase IGF-1 20-40% (at the same leptin level) by restoring Leptin sensitivity. Up to 80% in someone who was formerly obese (and presumably has a lot of Leptin resistance). Significant improvement in IGF within a couple of weeks after starting GLP, max improvement in studies seen around 12 weeks

That's really interesting, I'm going to check into this.

My thought was that the GLP-1 chronic use might have been impacting it, but apparently not the way I assumed?