Who here is on a statin?

[bubba618]

Would love opinions on red yeast rice here.

I’ve heard on a Justin Harris podcast that the active statin isnt allowed to be sold, yet people still get results on their bloodwork? Is COQ10 essential?

If this stuff is proven to work, curious to know why to opt for a medication over a more accessible alternative, assuming QC isnt a concern?

Red yeast rice has the active component monacolin K which is chemically identical to lovastatin, the first statin approved by the FDA. Lovastatin is still available but has been supplanted by atorvastatin and rosuvastatin.

So yes, red yeast rice supplements can and do aid in lipid control, but the variance in monacolin K per 1,200 mg capsule (usually 2-10mg per capsule) means exact dosing is impossible. Moreover, monacolin K is much less potent than either atorvastatin or rosuvastatin, and it would probably take 40-80 mg of lovastatin to achieve the results of 5 mg rosuvastatin or 10 mg atorvastatin.

Why opt for a medication that is dosed with high precision over a more accessible product with less precise dosing? You do understand that red yeast rice comes with the same side effects that the statins come with, yes? The difference is that with pharmaceuticals you have much more accurate dosing which aids in achieving your goals while minimizing harm.

 

[Anonymous35]

Would love opinions on red yeast rice here.

I’ve heard on a Justin Harris podcast that the active statin isnt allowed to be sold, yet people still get results on their bloodwork? Is COQ10 essential?

If this stuff is proven to work, curious to know why to opt for a medication over a more accessible alternative, assuming QC isnt a concern?

Red yeast is a statin too

 

[Anonymous35]

How many guys in this thread are in kidney failure? You are misinterpreting the information you are reading and jumping to conclusions that make no sense. Rosu isn't going to put you in kidney failure nor is it going to damage your kidneys. It just should not be taken by people who's kidneys are failing or near failure. See the difference?

Tylenol is hard on the liver and people with liver failure shouldn't take it. Do you think that means none of us should use Tylenol?

Atorvastatin is the original statin and generally speaking a "rougher" drug with more and higher incidence of side effects than the newer statins. Nothing inherently wrong with it and it is still a fairly safe drug with low side effect incidence and likely most of us would be fine using it, but I'd rather use the most effective and lowest side effect version available.

Bro has a kidney injurie thats why i give this advice which is not wrong

 

[bubba618]

Bro has a kidney injurie thats why i give this advice which is not wrong

My kidney is fine. I’ve been using Rosuvastatin for years. But I tore my groin muscle in 2 places which the doc considers a serious enough injury to throw off my labs. Plus doxycycline is hard on the liver and kidney but I only used it for 7 days. My next labs in 2 weeks will look much better.

No, as he stated clearly, he has no kidney injury. The muscle tear and the doxycycline he was on for infection both affected his labs in a manner that is usually associated with kidney damage, but when looking at the patient as a whole the lab numbers are explained.

Your advice ignored the patient's circumstances and assumed an injury which did not exist. The best response you could have made was, "I was mistaken when I thought he had a kidney injury."

To paraphrase an Arabian proverb, you know not, and you do not know that you know not which marks you as a fool who should be shunned.

 

[connoristiny]

Is atorvastatin a good one?

 

[egruberman]

Is atorvastatin a good one?

I would choose Rosuvastatin before Atorvastatin. They are both potent, but Rosuvastatin is moreso, especially at lower doses. Rosuvastatin is hydrophilic and doesn't cross the blood brain barrier. Atorvastatin is lipophilic and does. Rosuvastatin preferentially acts on the liver whereas Atorvastatin also acts on the brain and other tissues, muscles included. It is presumed that Rosuvastatin has fewer muscular side effects as a result.

 

[Anonymous35]

No, as he stated clearly, he has no kidney injury. The muscle tear and the doxycycline he was on for infection both affected his labs in a manner that is usually associated with kidney damage, but when looking at the patient as a whole the lab numbers are explained.

Your advice ignored the patient's circumstances and assumed an injury which did not exist. The best response you could have made was, "I was mistaken when I thought he had a kidney injury."

To paraphrase an Arabian proverb, you know not, and you do not know that you know not which marks you as a fool who should be shunned.

He had a acute kidney injurie then

yes doxycicline is hard but i don’t see a lot of acute kidney injuries from it
Same with the liver
Especially with only a week of use

 

[Anonymous35]

I would choose Rosuvastatin before Atorvastatin. They are both potent, but Rosuvastatin is moreso, especially at lower doses. Rosuvastatin is hydrophilic and doesn't cross the blood brain barrier. Atorvastatin is lipophilic and does. Rosuvastatin preferentially acts on the liver whereas Atorvastatin also acts on the brain and other tissues, muscles included. It is presumed that Rosuvastatin has fewer muscular side effects as a result.

Agreed unless you had CKD like me stay on rosuvastatin

 

[bubba618]

He had a acute kidney injurie then

yes doxycicline is hard but i don’t see a lot of acute kidney injuries from it
Same with the liver
Especially with only a week of use

A serious muscle tear could show up in blood tests within hours to a couple of days, while doxycycline on its own might take days to a week to have an impact. Together, though, they would likely cause changes in the blood tests faster than either one alone.

Now, let’s get this straight: @BamaCrazy's doctor—you know, a licensed professional—determined that the injury was severe enough to mess with the blood test results. The doctor also said that doxycycline could easily make those results worse.

And you? Are you a doctor? No, you’re not. You’re a lab tech with a Diplôme de Préparateur en Pharmacie, which doesn’t make you a pharmacist, much less a doctor. Maybe stick to what you’re trained for instead of stepping into roles you’re not qualified for.

At worst, this could be a transient acute kidney injury (AKI), but based on the info we’ve got, it sounds more like renal toxicity right now.

Oh, and by the way, EAS/ESC guidelines—along with KDIGO and AHA/ACC guidelines—all recommend statins, including rosuvastatin, for patients with CKD up until dialysis. These recommendations come from major studies like the SHARP, AURORA, and 4D trials.

One more thing: @BamaCrazy is on 10 mg rosuvastatin and 10 mg ezetimibe daily, which is a low to moderate dose of rosuvastatin. Every guideline out there says that’s a safe dose.

I suggest take this as a reminder to follow the pharmacist’s orders and stay within your lane, instead of trying to play doctor.

 

[bubba618]

Agreed unless you had CKD like me stay on rosuvastatin

You should consider the possibility that you have projection bias coupled with medical student syndrome. That is to say your condition (CKD) might be adversely affecting your ability to function objectively here.

 

[egruberman]

I don't think I've ever encountered a person with the moniker "bubba" write so articulately, or as they say on reddit, "username doesn't check out."

 

[connoristiny]

I would choose Rosuvastatin before Atorvastatin. They are both potent, but Rosuvastatin is moreso, especially at lower doses. Rosuvastatin is hydrophilic and doesn't cross the blood brain barrier. Atorvastatin is lipophilic and does. Rosuvastatin preferentially acts on the liver whereas Atorvastatin also acts on the brain and other tissues, muscles included. It is presumed that Rosuvastatin has fewer muscular side effects as a result.

Agreed unless you had CKD like me stay on rosuvastatin

Even at lower doses?

 

[egruberman]

Even at lower doses?

I think @bubba618 covered that pretty well, with regard to CKD and Rosuvastatin.

If you're asking about efficacy, then Rosuvastatin is far superior to Atorvastatin at lower doses.

 

[Anonymous35]

A serious muscle tear could show up in blood tests within hours to a couple of days, while doxycycline on its own might take days to a week to have an impact. Together, though, they would likely cause changes in the blood tests faster than either one alone.

Now, let’s get this straight: @BamaCrazy's doctor—you know, a licensed professional—determined that the injury was severe enough to mess with the blood test results. The doctor also said that doxycycline could easily make those results worse.

And you? Are you a doctor? No, you’re not. You’re a lab tech with a Diplôme de Préparateur en Pharmacie, which doesn’t make you a pharmacist, much less a doctor. Maybe stick to what you’re trained for instead of stepping into roles you’re not qualified for.

At worst, this could be a transient acute kidney injury (AKI), but based on the info we’ve got, it sounds more like renal toxicity right now.

Oh, and by the way, EAS/ESC guidelines—along with KDIGO and AHA/ACC guidelines—all recommend statins, including rosuvastatin, for patients with CKD up until dialysis. These recommendations come from major studies like the SHARP, AURORA, and 4D trials.

One more thing: @BamaCrazy is on 10 mg rosuvastatin and 10 mg ezetimibe daily, which is a low to moderate dose of rosuvastatin. Every guideline out there says that’s a safe dose.

I suggest take this as a reminder to follow the pharmacist’s orders and stay within your lane, instead of trying to play doctor.

« at worst he could be a transcient acute kidney injury » oh that was my statement
I never said i was a doctor i always be honest with my job

Bro i probably know far more thing that you will ever be able to even understand

And no rosuvastatin with chronic kidney fairlure isn’t recommand and we use atorvastatin instead

And being a doctor dosn’t mean is right
How many times i see prescription from patient or even my family with no fucking sense at all

So yeah maybe in general its true but not for me

 

[Anonymous35]

I think @bubba618 covered that pretty well, with regard to CKD and Rosuvastatin.

If you're asking about efficacy, then Rosuvastatin is far superior to Atorvastatin at lower doses.

Efficacy yes i didn’t say that but when your kidney arent working properly i will not wait to go on dialyse to change to atorvastatin

Because lets say your kidney works at 50%, i don’t think you need to be at 10% to then changed those treatments
You can start right away. Not hope for the best

 

[Anonymous35]

Even at lower doses?

5 / 10 mg seem to be pretty safe depend of your kidney fonction and the direction if its maintain or getting worse / better
Ezetimibe is also good

Its also depend if you had myalgia or not

The saffest statin is fluvastatatin and pravastatin but there are not as potent as rosuvastatin and atorvastatin
But atorvastatin is 2 times less potent as rosuvastatin

 

[Anonymous35]

You should consider the possibility that you have projection bias coupled with medical student syndrome. That is to say your condition (CKD) might be adversely affecting your ability to function objectively here.

Hm no it’s a rare desease that I have 1 in 30000 so no probably no one here has it

But bodybuilder and kidney desease are very common so no i don’t project

 

[egruberman]

Efficacy yes i didn’t say that but when your kidney arent working properly i will not wait to go on dialyse to change to atorvastatin

You're spreading misinformation again. Generally speaking for patients on dialysis, Atorvastatin is the first choice. That said, Rosuvastatin is still used possibly with dose adjustment.

But atorvastatin is 2 times less potent as rosuvastatin

More misinformation. The rule of thumb for dosing equivalence is 2:1, but that doesn't making Rosuvastatin 2x more potent. It's a rule of thumb, you twit:

But bodybuilder and kidney desease are very common so no i don’t project

Yeah, no. You're out of your league. Impaired kidney function is pretty fucking far from "common" in bodybuilders. It happens, to a few, that aren't paying attention to their health and if you haven't noticed, that doesn't include the members of this forum and particularly those in this thread.

 

[Sampei]

I have put him on ignore because I can't bother to read all the bullshit he says. This nurse boy is really a fucktard but kudos to you guys that keep answering his shit and don't let him continue to spread misinformation and dangerous advise

 

[Anonymous35]

You're spreading misinformation again. Generally speaking for patients on dialysis, Atorvastatin is the first choice. That said, Rosuvastatin is still used possibly with dose adjustment.



More misinformation. The rule of thumb for dosing equivalence is 2:1, but that doesn't making Rosuvastatin 2x more potent. It's a rule of thumb, you twit:

View attachment 312900




Yeah, no. You're out of your league. Impaired kidney function is pretty fucking far from "common" in bodybuilders. It happens, to a few, that aren't paying attention to their health and if you haven't noticed, that doesn't include the members of this forum and particularly those in this thread.

most of you don’t compete at all so you’re not even a bodybuilder

I never said it was the same i said 20 mg atorvastatin has mostly the same effect as rosuvastatin but different side effects
And no your just a moron its not just when you are on dialyse its already not recommended when you had CKD at least in france
Thats why atorvastatin in france is the most prescribed statin and also in the world

Its crazy how as a professional health i had to justify myself to people who stop studing at 15yo lmao

So yeah if rosuvastatin is so much better than atorvastatin why doctor still prefer used atorvastatin ?
Because its not even close
So yeah i will explain to you again with CKD is not recommended to used rosuvastatin because it has been showed to increased hematuria and need to kidney transplant

But if you don’t then yeah used rosuvastatin
But atorvastatin is fine too
Depend on how your body react