Qingdao Sigma Chemical Co., Ltd (International, US, EU, Canada and Australia domestic

[gburdell]

In general, I prefer to minimize risk by not being an early adopter. By the time I used Sema (or Tirz), millions of "Patient years" of clinical experience had been established by their initial use for diabetes, and of course that was built on a 30 year history of earlier short acting GLPs.

Personally, while I respect adventurousness into new compounds (I worked my way through TIHKAL and PIHKAL decades ago if you know what those are), the question I'd be asking myself is "What are you trying to gain that offsets the additional risk, however small, of drugs we have significantly less experience with?"

So far all I've seen is possibly low single digit greater max weight loss potential, which I don't need. Slightly faster liver fat clearance which I don't need. So in my mind it's all additional risk, higher cost, and no benefit.

Again I think a lot of this may stem from thinking of these compounds like diet pills, and the "new ones" are "more effective" so I should use those.

Also, the primary driver in most of these is not to be "better", but to give each company a unique formulation they can patent and market in order to compete with Tirz.

If tirz or sema work well for you, then definitely don't mess with success.

But reta's "low single digit greater max weight loss" ends up being a what, 20-30% difference between it and tirz?

What I've noticed is that it doesn't have nearly the appetite suppression that tirz did, but it definitely does (for me) cause visceral fat loss and much greater vascularity.

 

[Middus]

Here's the thing. Everyone's got their own risk tolerance, certainly do your own thing.

I'm not a fan of having to monitor for higher glucose levels, but I'm most concerned about the acceleration of undiagnosed cancer. If it were one and done, I could deal with the limited risk for long term benefit, but the visceral fat quickly returns in unless Tesa is taken continuously. GLP/GIP offer similar benefits, without the risk of a slow growing tumor somewhere getting turbocharged. That's why it's only approved for people with HIV. Everyone can benefit from reduced visceral fat, but it's only in this population is the risk considered worth it, in some part, reading between the lines, because of the severe psychological effects of simultaneous muscle loss and rapid and abnormally distributed (ie freaky looking) fat gain in HIV patients.

Growth hormone and tesamorelin in the management of HIV-associated lipodystrophy - PMC

HIV-infected patients on highly active antiretroviral therapy (HAART) develop a complex of body composition changes known, including peripheral fat loss (lipoatrophy) and central fat accumulation (lipohypertrophy). These changes may cause ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"During the continuation phase of the studies, the improvement in VAT was not sustained among patients who were re-randomized to placebo after 26 weeks of therapy with tesamorelin (T-P). However, those randomized to continue tesamorelin for an additional 26 weeks (T-T) experienced a sustained reduction in VAT....

The rapid reversal of the tesamorelin effects on body fat and lipid levels upon discontinuation of therapy is probably explained by the reversal of IGF-1 increases. "

Note: This is a pathological state. HIV itself predisposes to cancer because of weakened immunity. Also HIV and anti retroviral meds is what is causing the lipodystrophy, so it's not shocking that when TESA stops the fat returns.
I did some small research on Tesa because i wanted to add it to my stack. I was confused with all the youtube videos telling us to take Tesa in a fasted state, yet Egrifta (that has been proven to cut visceral fat) comes with no such instructions. I suspect the fasting part is because of concerns about HGH release and carbs in the system.
I eventually started taking tesa when I found a study in healthy individuals albeit very short term, showing that IGF rises but insulin still does what It should do, so perhaps cycling Tesa works.

Effects of a Growth Hormone-Releasing Hormone Analog on Endogenous GH Pulsatility and Insulin Sensitivity in Healthy Men

Context and Objective: Strategies to augment pulsatile GH may be beneficial in patients with excess visceral adiposity, in whom GH secretion is reduced. Th

academic.oup.com

 

[Middus]

If tirz or sema work well for you, then definitely don't mess with success.

But reta's "low single digit greater max weight loss" ends up being a what, 20-30% difference between it and tirz?

What I've noticed is that it doesn't have nearly the appetite suppression that tirz did, but it definitely does (for me) cause visceral fat loss and much greater vascularity.

It's like Ghoul alluded to earlier. Some people think GLPs work by simply cutting appetite. That's GLP1 activity. Reta has glucagon activity to. Cutting the boring details short, people actually burn calories even at rest due to the glucagon activity. It pushes metabolism up a bit, while having a weaker GLP1 activity than Sema. and Tirz

 

[Ghoul]

You think the benefits of GLP1s are maintained after discontinuation? (study)

Or you still on the GLP1-for-life train

rapid weight regain doesn't seem great for organ health
View attachment 287696

I've made my position completely clear. GLP is a hormone. These drugs are hormone supplements. The basic advance that brought us to where we are today was extending their half life from seconds to weeks, similar in effect to adding an ester to testosterone.

Few would advise a guy with low T to go off his TRT after a few months. The same applies to raising GLP levels.

Yes, weight cycling is harmful to health.

Intermittent use of GLPs is a mistake, stemming from a misunderstanding of how they work. There's also ample reason, seemingly a new one every week, coming from medical science to keep GLP (and GIP) levels elevated for life.

Of course this, like every side, disappears once you reach a maintainance dose. The drug "fades into the background".

I've been on maintenance for years, except for a brief transition from Sema to tirz.

The "maintainance dose" is whatever dose you stay on after you've reached your goal weight, and the drug is essentially neutral at that point, unless you gain weight, which would be via "eating beyond your appetite", then the effects kick in again.

For Tirz, 7.5mg. 10mg, 12.5mg or 15mg can be maintainince doses. For Sema it's 1.7mg, 2mg, or 2.4mg.

If you can't get to the minimum maintainance doses without intolerable sides you're supposed to discontinue the drug, per the monographs doctors are supposed to follow, and insurance will cut you off if you can't get there within a year.

.

Weight loss has been unquestionable established as durable as long as maintenance doses are continued.

The problem is a lack of knowledge on the part of patients and less sophisticated providers.

Without understanding how this works, they treat GLPs like a "diet pill". Something like amphetamine or even caffeine that temporarily suppresses appetite, you lose weight, then stop taking it. When the appetite suppression stops they think it's "tolerance" to the drug.

I blame pharma for this. I don't think they wanted to emphasize these drugs are intended to be used for life. Just as insulin corrects a hormone deficiency for diabetics, TRT for hypogonadosm, GLPs correct a glucagon deficiency.

The good news is that rather than suffering from "using a drug long term", high levels of GLPs in your system have some incredibly good effects on an ever increasing list of organs. It's uses are already extending to people who don't need to lose weight (see liver disease above), and as a side effect it'll help prevent them from ever developing obesity in the first place.

One other note. I think it's a mistake to jump on and off repeatedly as many are doing. There's some thin observational evidence, and my own experience aligns with this, that coming off and going back on after an extended break seems to require higher doses for the same appetite suppression effect. "The thermostat gets harder to turn" in effect. It seems more prudent to stay on, at least a small dose, continuously.

 

[Ghoul]

If tirz or sema work well for you, then definitely don't mess with success.

But reta's "low single digit greater max weight loss" ends up being a what, 20-30% difference between it and tirz?

What I've noticed is that it doesn't have nearly the appetite suppression that tirz did, but it definitely does (for me) cause visceral fat loss and much greater vascularity.

How long do you expect to stay on it, or another GLP drug?

What do you expect to happen when you come off?

 

[RiceNKimchi]

Hey, it’s been a while, where’d you been brother?

Doing great brother. I've been on trt ish 200/100 mg primo getting my bloods to normal for a couple months. I took a break from all this drama here lol

 

[Ghoul]

Published 2 days ago at an international conference of nerve specialists:

TLDR: There's growing evidence GLP/GIPs (Tirz/Reta) protect and *regenerate* damaged nerves, throughout the body, including those responsible for causing cognitive decline, Alzheimer's and Parkinson's.

--------------

What we do know about medications that work on the GIP and the GLP-1 receptors, particularly the GIP receptors, is that they affect neurons," said Russell.

He added that there is also the suggestion that these medications may help regenerate hippocampal neurons.

In addition, "there's evidence for drugs that affect the GIP receptor that they may be protective in animal models of parkinsonism or Alzheimer's disease. So, in other words, there's this idea that this isn't just a diabetic drug anymore it potentially, in fact, could affect diseases where there is neuronal degeneration," he added.

Commenting on the research for Medscape Medical News, Arun Krishnan, PhD, professor and head of the Neuromuscular Disease Research Group, University of New South Wales, and a neurologist at Prince of Wales Hospital in Sydney, Australia, said that these data are supported by recent work by his own group, which shows GLP-1 receptor agonists are highly effective treatments for improving nerve morphology, clinical symptoms, and nerve conduction parameters.

"This is a very exciting area of research as it suggests that diabetic peripheral neuropathy may be a treatable neuropathy, something that would have been considered unimaginable a decade ago. Given the enormous global burden of this condition, these treatments may have the potential to reduce neuropathy disability worldwide," said Krishnan.

He added that another paper from his team also suggests that these medications have a direct effect on peripheral nerves. "I don't think that it is due to weight loss or diabetic control. We have another manuscript, currently under review, that will support that argument," he added.

Reduced Risk for Peripheral Neuropathy Tied to Diabetes Med

The dual GIP–GLP-1 receptor agonist tirzepatide that has shown significant benefits in diabetes and obesity may also help prevent diabetic peripheral neuropathy, new research suggests.

www.medscape.com

 

[Northfortuly]

Then shut up already, mutual decision and nothing to do with you at all.

You missed the part where he said he “got two girlfriends to” have abortions. Nothing in that statement sounds like it was mutual or that they wanted to. Maybe it’s an argument over semantics, but unless he worded it wrong, it sounds gross.

You’re talking to a woman, and you’d be surprised how many times we are coerced, bullied, or told to abort by men who casually talk about how they “got” us to have abortions.

Iris was not replying to the procedure itself, but the way buddy seemed so flippant about getting women to abort.

 

[rufflesbaby]

when QSC merch coming? I want a shirt or something

 

[galaxus]

I had constipation beyond just the gastric slowing and lower calls. Had to take Metamucil or stool softener pretty regularly. My brother did not tho ‍

Thank you. Good to hear it is not just me. For me it was Retatrutide.Yes eventually it is also stool softener. Definitely side effects. I think 2-3 months is max this should be run.

 

[xrayphoton13]

In general, I prefer to minimize risk by not being an early adopter. By the time I used Sema (or Tirz), millions of "Patient years" of clinical experience had been established by their initial use for diabetes, and of course that was built on a 30 year history of earlier short acting GLPs.

Personally, while I respect adventurousness into new compounds (I worked my way through TIHKAL and PIHKAL decades ago if you know what those are), the question I'd be asking myself is "What are you trying to gain that offsets the additional risk, however small, of drugs we have significantly less experience with?"

So far all I've seen is possibly low single digit greater max weight loss potential, which I don't need. Slightly faster liver fat clearance which I don't need. So in my mind it's all additional risk, higher cost, and no benefit.

Again I think a lot of this may stem from thinking of these compounds like diet pills, and the "new ones" are "more effective" so I should use those.

Also, the primary driver in most of these is not to be "better", but to give each company a unique formulation they can patent and market in order to compete with Tirz.

I believe retatrutide is being developed by Eli Lilly, the same company that developed tirzepatide. I'm not sure how they plan to market it due to that. I doubt they would replace tirzepatide. It's only a few percent better at weight loss from what I've seen. Less food noise suppression but higher resting metabolic rate due to the glucagon action

 

[AlexDavis43]

I believe retatrutide is being developed by Eli Lilly, the same company that developed tirzepatide. I'm not sure how they plan to market it due to that. I doubt they would replace tirzepatide. It's only a few percent better at weight loss from what I've seen. Less food noise suppression but higher resting metabolic rate due to the glucagon action

Time will tell. You know how it goes: everyone wants results in 6 days, 6 weeks, 6 years? Millennials (no offense) are poisoned with instant gratification mentality.

 

[Northfortuly]

@Qingdao Sigma Chemicals any plans or info on Bimagrumab/BYM338?

 

[egruberman]

I worked my way through TIHKAL and PIHKAL decades ago

I hope you realize that Sasha was in pretty rough shape cognitively before he died. These aren't the words of someone that's "risk averse" as you say.

 

[Qingdao Sigma Chemicals]

Price list​

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New discord server link:

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[Qingdao Sigma Chemicals]

Take advantage of the last days of the promo on HGH and fat loss products!

the prices are the cheapest you can find and everything is tested​

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[Justaguy99]

Just received my primo from the group buy from qsc. First time ordering oils from them blue bottles what is confusion is that it is labeled peach oil. My peptides never come labeled is this normal?

Yup.
Advertising the stealth is genius.
Lol

 

[Letits now]

Yup.
Advertising the stealth is genius.
Lol

Ugh. There should really be a test for entry.

 

[baxter0312]

Just received my primo from the group buy from qsc. First time ordering oils from them blue bottles what is confusion is that it is labeled peach oil. My peptides never come labeled is this normal?

Yup.
Advertising the stealth is genius.
Lol

Peach oil?
That’s probably anti stealth.
So stupid the customs agent gets mad

Like when the IRS finds out you’re playing games they go super saiyan

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

I had a 4-5 day t/a for the 50mg tirz last week. Ordered 13 kits of it lol