MESO "Specialized" Testing Group Fund

[AlexDavis43]

NPP by QSC two samples November 2024

Janoshik Analytical

Janoshik Analytical

I have paid for the purity test do you feel like it would help the cause if we use the meso fund to get GCMS on both?

They are the same one

 

[Sampei]

They are the same one

No they are not, look sample 1 and sample 2

 

[readalot]

Very important typo. I meant to say fairly inaccurate. Thank you @readalot for bringing this to my attention.


Long story short, I decided to do some basic statistics. Note the uncofindence in my statement — these kinds of statements are closer to "more likely than not" rather than "95% confidence". This is mainly due to the small sample size (~10) more than anything. Again, the conclusion is supposed to be that GCMS area is not accurate rather than is.

Longer explanation:
We have two methods that are essentially measuring purity, some more accurate than others. If we make three basic assumptions, we can do some comparative statistics like lims of agreement. We do this by making a table of GCMS vs HPLC data (of the same samples) and then comparing.

Assumptions:
First: All samples are thoroughly mixed and consistent throughout, especially when one individual sends two samples for testing. This is less likely with bodybuilders rather than actual researchers, but still expected.
Second: Jano's hplc is indeed very accurate, other than confusing very similar compounds like d4,6.
Third: There are no significant quantities of involatile substances. This is the least certain, but is still likely due to how organic synthesis works practically.

If so, we can create a spreadsheet with 2 columns. For the HPLC column, we just write the purity. For the gcms, we add any compounds' areas that will almost certainly coelute on hplc (in general this is only testosterone and d4,6 - see below for more info). Then we just compute the residuals, do some altman analysis, etc. While the statistical power is lacking with only n=~10, it can still tell us a lot. Honestly, if anyone here has any time, please make a spreadsheet of any janoshik reports that you have of the same sample, with gcms and hplc. If we can get enough data, we could even do cluster analysis and find patterns with Jano's testing, possibly even with vendors.


This is a bit less scientific, and is mostly a combination of: how likely two molecules are to coelute based on structure (in the case of d4,6, I would say the damning aspect is that the double bond is in very close proximity to the d4 bond, unlike modifications far away from it like boldenone or nandrolone) and published data, how the hplc raw data looks (especially the chromatograms, I actually think that I saw a shoulder peak on one), how it compares to the gcms, etc. Its a bit hard to explain, but at minimum I haven't seen anything nearly as flagrant as the d4,6 and testosterone.

Thank you for the detailed comments. While I give them the attention they deserve here's some related data for oils in case you had not seen it.

Thread 'GCMS and HPLC -- any relationship?'

Aug 25, 2025

Paying for both GCMS and HPLC is very costly.
170 + 120 = 290.

I was wondering if there is a way to estimate HPLC mg/ml, via GCMS.
These are the GCMS that can be found on this forum, credit goes to @MuscularMD for doing most of them.

		A	B	C	D = A - C	E = D / A
		HPLC MG/ML	GCMS %	B * 1000	Variance	Variance %
PRIMAL	TC	204	19.98%	199.8	4	2%

...

• Photon

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[readalot]

100% im the least experienced here so great to pick up some info.

for me on this test

They're 32 h apart, but retention times is almost similar. so i dont think the mz difference is the culprit but the retention times. base peak is also 11k vs 15k

Janoshik Analytical

Janoshik Analytical

Hold up. My AI app subscription lapsed. Give me a little bit.

 

[dinfar1337]

Hold up. My AI app subscription lapsed. Give me a little bit.

maybe ghoul has some good recommendations.

 

[readalot]

maybe ghoul has some good recommendations.

 

[Sampei]

So? Instead of spamming shit what should I tell Jano GCMS yes or not?

I mean the fucking thread is already a mess without us spamming gif, don't you think?

 

[readalot]

While the statistical power is lacking with only n=~10, it can still tell us a lot. Honestly, if anyone here has any time, please make a spreadsheet of any janoshik reports that you have of the same sample, with gcms and hplc

@Photon got it tighter and no point in arguing about overfitting on a forum but to your point. GCMS API% and HPLC mg/ml correlation very tight.

https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/gcms-and-hplc-any-relationship.134431552/post-3567789

 

[readalot]

So? Instead of spamming shit what should I tell Jano GCMS yes or not?

I mean the fucking thread is already a mess without us spamming gif, don't you think?

Haven't went through your latest data. I would say yes.

 

[Sampei]

Haven't went through your latest data. I would say yes.

Asked for raw data on both and GCMS on sample 1 ( the least pure)

 

[readalot]

Asked for raw data on both and GCMS on sample 1 ( the least pure)

Should be spending my time here. You are right. TBF, I am human.

 

[TallandSmall]

Thanks to everyone taking the time to process statistics, make spreadsheets, send samples, and educate those of us that don’t work in related fields. Always happy to pitch in for more testing whenever funds get low.

 

[AlexDavis43]

Asked for raw data on both and GCMS on sample 1 ( the least pure)

Can't keep this shit straight in my head

From what I vaguely recall: the issue was NPP contaminated with something like TNE, but TNE didn't show up on HPLC...?

So the point of repeating GCMS on another NPP sample is to see if it's common for NPP to be contaminated with a mysterious TPP-like compound that evades detection by HPLC ?

 

[dinfar1337]

From what I vaguely recall: the issue was NPP contaminated with something like TNE, but TNE didn't show up on HPLC...?

the autoid name by gcms was inaccurate.

i went and asked jano for this and he said hes sure its not andro skeleton(would be testosterone then) but almost surely estro(nandrolone) skeleton from the molar mass being so similar to npp(its a impurity and becomes useless like the tne impurity, probably problematic with estrone skeleton since its 100% sure its gonna become estrogen or progesterone)

Post in thread 'Janoshik Analytical laboratory testing services'

Oct 3, 2025

@janoshik im just generally confused

Janoshik Analytical

this test says "nandrolone degradation products"

but its literally npp + andro skeleton and not estro skeleton we would have in nandrolone.

just want to make sure its not a naming error and the raw have testosterone in it.

the hplc came back as 89% npp

• dinfar1337

i do agree with this is just repetitive testing. we aren't gona find new info with it.

its overkill but we could do

Post in thread 'Janoshik Analytical laboratory testing services'

Oct 1, 2025

Hi @janoshik

We have the following raw purity % and gcms.
Per GCMS, it looks like there are test degradation products.
Is this treated as TNE in HPLC?
Is there a way to get the true purity of just TNE?

Janoshik Analytical

Janoshik Analytical

View attachment 351950
View attachment 351949

Maybe it's thermal caused by GC? Maybe HPLC can't distinguish between 5 and 6?

QNMR to be sure, integrate every hydrogen, 500 bucks.

• janoshik

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[dinfar1337]

i wouldnt be too happy about that 70% percent if i was b ware

this is like the highest area % we found yet. and even if gcms isnt calibrated for api% i dont think the error magin is bigger than 10% at most!

Janoshik Analytical

 

[readalot]

i wouldnt be too happy about that 70% percent if i was b ware

this is like the highest area % we found yet. and even if gcms isnt calibrated for api% i dont think the error magin is bigger than 10% at most!

Janoshik Analytical

How dare you impugn those 99+% raws!!

This vendor uses 1H NMR to qualify those righteous anabolic powders. Says so right here.

https://thinksteroids.com/community...er-manufacturer-aasraw.134415442/post-3201643

Probably just got "overheated" a bit during shipment. Quality stuff.

 

[Photon]

How dare you impugn those 99+% raws!!

This vendor uses 1H NMR to qualify those righteous anabolic powders. Says so right here.

https://thinksteroids.com/community...er-manufacturer-aasraw.134415442/post-3201643

Probably just got "overheated" a bit during shipment. Quality stuff.

AFAIK they only used HPLC n MS

MESO-Rx Sponsor Post in thread 'Genuine Steroid Powder Manufacturer-AASraw'

Sep 29, 2025

Product: Nandrolone phenylpropionate powder
CAS: 62-90-8
Loading time: October

It has been tested by labs and the quality was confirmed.
Please find HPLC and MS reports below:




HPLC report(High-performance liquid chromatography ) is to show how the purity is of the compound: High-performance liquid chromatography - Wikipedia
MS report(Mass Spectrometry) is to identify what the compound is: Mass spectrometry - Wikipedia

Welcome to take the order on NPP or more products from us!

Email: king@aasraw.co

• AASraw

 

[readalot]

AFAIK they only used HPLC n MS

MESO-Rx Sponsor Post in thread 'Genuine Steroid Powder Manufacturer-AASraw'

Sep 29, 2025

Product: Nandrolone phenylpropionate powder
CAS: 62-90-8
Loading time: October

It has been tested by labs and the quality was confirmed.
Please find HPLC and MS reports below:




HPLC report(High-performance liquid chromatography ) is to show how the purity is of the compound: High-performance liquid chromatography - Wikipedia
MS report(Mass Spectrometry) is to identify what the compound is: Mass spectrometry - Wikipedia

Welcome to take the order on NPP or more products from us!

Email: king@aasraw.co

• AASraw

Pristine, isn't it?

 

[Sera]

They need to fire their lab…

 

[Sampei]

Janoshik Analytical

GCMS of the NPP sample from QSC

@readalot @dinfar1337 @Photon