Hitting muscles from different angles is hyped out bullshit!

[Demondosage]

I'm sure I'm gonna catch a lot of shit from people on this, but I just don't believe in all of these "angles" that are out there.

I think if you took 2 different guys and had one guy just do barbell curls and the other guy does 3-4 different exercises, the first guy could still blow him away in results if he had better diet, supplementation, and work ethic. I have found that often only doing 1 or 2 exercises is better because u focus more and don't get so jumbled up with trying to accomplish all of these different angles. I just don't buy into all of this shit on angles, the muscle has a genetic shape it follows, period

 

[incrediblebulk]

I don't know that I agree with all that you are saying. For smaller muscles such as biceps I generally do two lifts. So I agree with you on the number of different lifts. I do however change angles or lifts from one week to the next. I don't know that is made my gains better or worse. I mainly do it so I don't get bored with the monotony.

 

[JackC4]

I think if you took 2 different guys and had one guy just do barbell curls and the other guy does 3-4 different exercises, the first guy could still blow him away in results if he had better diet, supplementation, and work ethic. period

What if the playing field was even? Same diet, supps, same intensity.
Do you think this would still be the case?

We are all at the mercy of our genetics anyhow lol

 

[Demondosage]

Yea man, I really think your muscle has a genetic shape it conforms to, the different exercises have minimal impact, I'm not saying they may not have a little, but not to the degree most claim. Just my beliefs anyways

 

[MANWHORE]

I think if the weight is light, then
Incline bench might differ from decline...
If its heavy enough, then everything gets hit...

I think a lot of guys should be squating
And deadlifting and forgetting about
All the angles, anyway ...
I love squats and deads ..

There is no feeling in the world as good
As lifting up a 200lb man like as if he is
A big bag of popcorn and slamming him
On his back .. I hang dumbbells on the end
Of the bar, cause 300 just isn't cutting it..

 

[radcon]

You are correct dd.
People do have a genetically set muscle belly length. Some have a longer muscle belly while others have a longer tendinous attachment. Even where the tendon attaches is different. For example, the bicep attaches further out on the radius on some than others. The calves are probably the most notorious bodypart when it come to genetic curses or blessings.
I never curl or do any isolation movements anymore and I don't look any worse for it - in fact I'm pretty sure I look better.

Also keep in mind that naming muscles comes down to semantics to some extent - so muscles in close proximity to each other sometimes get lumped in as being the same muscle even though they're really a different muscle with possibly a bit different function. For example, the pec major has a sternal attachment and a clavicular attachment. We call them both the pec major but what if someone had name them two completely different things? - It would technically be more accurate.

The brain doesn't care about individual muscles, it cares about movement patterns and muscles can have very different functions. For example - bodybuilders think that the quadriceps muscles extend the knee but in sprinting - the quadriceps act extremely eccentrically as a shock absorber (you can almost think of it as a break but shock absorber is probably more accurate).

 

[idmd]

You are correct dd.
People do have a genetically set muscle belly length. Some have a longer muscle belly while others have a longer tendinous attachment. Even where the tendon attaches is different. For example, the bicep attaches further out on the radius on some than others. The calves are probably the most notorious bodypart when it come to genetic curses or blessings.
I never curl or do any isolation movements anymore and I don't look any worse for it - in fact I'm pretty sure I look better.

Also keep in mind that naming muscles comes down to semantics to some extent - so muscles in close proximity to each other sometimes get lumped in as being the same muscle even though they're really a different muscle with possibly a bit different function. For example, the pec major has a sternal attachment and a clavicular attachment. We call them both the pec major but what if someone had name them two completely different things? - It would technically be more accurate.

The brain doesn't care about individual muscles, it cares about movement patterns and muscles can have very different functions. For example - bodybuilders think that the quadriceps muscles extend the knee but in sprinting - the quadriceps act extremely eccentrically as a shock absorber (you can almost think of it as a break but shock absorber is probably more accurate).

Isn't that the natural progression? I think when I started I did nothing but isolation lifts. Then I discovered compound lifts and did those with isolation lifts.

Today I noticed during my dead lifts my even my biceps and triceps got a pump. Or when I do DB presses I can feel my traps.

As time goes on I do less and less ISO movements.

 

[weekend]

i think you're right for some stuff. but why do i feel my outer tricep so much on widegrip pushdowns but my long head so much more on skullcrushers?

or my subclavius muscle which doesn't seem to get any stimulation from flat bench but tons from incline?

back wise, only close grip pulldowns will hit my lower lats hardest, and only rows can get that rhomboid goin....

but not sure if thats what you mean

 

[radcon]

Isn't that the natural progression? I think when I started I did nothing but isolation lifts. Then I discovered compound lifts and did those with isolation lifts.

Today I noticed during my dead lifts my even my biceps and triceps got a pump. Or when I do DB presses I can feel my traps.

As time goes on I do less and less ISO movements.

I don't know if it's the natural progression. People go all kinds of directions. Some get into lifting in sports which emphasize compound lifts and then get into isolation movements. Others start with isolation movements because they want to look good and read about iso movements in a magazine and eventually progress to compound movements. I got my start in isolation movements so I guess that pattern holds true for you and me.

 

[Demondosage]

I have found the largest benefit not to be in specific lifts themselves, but in the brains ability to control and contract each muscle to its maximum potential. On a wide grip pull-up for example, the way my back feels now is totally different than 15 years ago when I was just trying to get my chin to the bar and not focusing on everything coming together in my back

 

[radcon]

i think you're right for some stuff. but why do i feel my outer tricep so much on widegrip pushdowns but my long head so much more on skullcrushers?

or my subclavius muscle which doesn't seem to get any stimulation from flat bench but tons from incline?

back wise, only close grip pulldowns will hit my lower lats hardest, and only rows can get that rhomboid goin....

but not sure if thats what you mean

Your subclavius? You've gotta be the first person to ever mention feeling their subclavius working. Made me chuckle.

It's not that you can't emphasize a particular section of a muscle to make that portion contract harder because we do have contractile control over muscles. I think the point being made is that for most of us, we don't particularly gain anything from doing it. Most of us would look pretty similar if we just did a compound lift based routine vs an isolation type routine. For competitive bodybuilders, where minutia matters, isolation makes sense except I guess that's what synthols for.[)]

Do your biceps care that you did bb curls followed by preachers, then incline dbell, then hammers? Probably not - they'd probably look pretty much the same with no curls and a routine with chinups/pullups, rowing, deadlifting, etc.

But then I think about all those guys with disproportionately large arms compared to the rest of their unathletic looking body because all they do is curl and I think maybe I'm wrong.

 

[Liffalot]

Isn't that the natural progression? I think when I started I did nothing but isolation lifts. Then I discovered compound lifts and did those with isolation lifts.

Today I noticed during my dead lifts my even my biceps and triceps got a pump. Or when I do DB presses I can feel my traps.

As time goes on I do less and less ISO movements.

I don't know about that. My lifting career started with my old man who was a football player and then moved into football lifting for quite some time. Naturally, that consisted of almost exclusively compound exercises. Only recently have I started doing any isolation exercises whatsoever.

So I suppose your progression depends on where you start

 

[MythotiK]

I'm sure I'm gonna catch a lot of shit from people on this, but I just don't believe in all of these "angles" that are out there.

I think if you took 2 different guys and had one guy just do barbell curls and the other guy does 3-4 different exercises, the first guy could still blow him away in results if he had better diet, supplementation, and work ethic. I have found that often only doing 1 or 2 exercises is better because u focus more and don't get so jumbled up with trying to accomplish all of these different angles. I just don't buy into all of this shit on angles, the muscle has a genetic shape it follows, period

I disagree...

Take two people and have then just build the pec muscle...

Guy one, only doing standard bench...

Guy two, doing incline, decline, barbell, and crossover...

I workout the same muscles every week:

Mon: Back and Bi's
Tues: Chest and tri's
and so on...But I do a different lifts each week for the same muscle...you have to "trick" the muscle to make it grow better imo

 

[Desibaba]

Have you guys ever seen any pictures of a teen bodybuilder and then later on after he added tons of muscle as a pro? Look at before and afters of guys like Jay Cutler, Phil Heath, Kevin Levrone, Ronnie Coleman etc. Every single one of them just became a much larger version of their former selves. Not one changed the shape of their biceps etc.

Ronnie's biceps had that twin baseball peaks to them while Kevin had Football shaped biceps. Show me one single person with a before and after where he actually managed to improve the peak of his biceps etc without using oil or an implant. The shape NEVER changes. All you can do is make a muscle bigger or smaller.

 

[Mike Oxbig]

Have you guys ever seen any pictures of a teen bodybuilder and then later on after he added tons of muscle as a pro? Look at before and afters of guys like Jay Cutler, Phil Heath, Kevin Levrone, Ronnie Coleman etc. Every single one of them just became a much larger version of their former selves. Not one changed the shape of their biceps etc.

Ronnie's biceps had that twin baseball peaks to them while Kevin had Football shaped biceps. Show me one single person with a before and after where he actually managed to improve the peak of his biceps etc without using oil or an implant. The shape NEVER changes. All you can do is make a muscle bigger or smaller.

I think it goes without saying that muscle insertions, muscle belly shapes, etc. are genetically fixed. I'm not sure what you're trying to get at.

 

[radcon]

I think it goes without saying that muscle insertions, muscle belly shapes, etc. are genetically fixed. I'm not sure what you're trying to get at.

I think when you're young, you see guys like Arnold and various bodybuilders and think that with hard work and dedication, you can someday look like that. You don't really understand the whole genetic component to things.

And then there's all the marketing that greedily exploits this naive view and feeds on hope.

But eventually, many realize the genetic component and the drug component and all that -- At least this was kind of my experience.

 

[Desibaba]

I think it goes without saying that muscle insertions, muscle belly shapes, etc. are genetically fixed. I'm not sure what you're trying to get at.

What I mean is that you cant build a better "Peak" to your biceps by doing concentration curls nor can you pull a high triceps down. The shape is what it is. You can make it bigger though.