HGH + Retatrutide

[deadbeef]

What’s the source of that data?

The various studies done on both.

Without dose and duration it doesn’t tell us anything,

Read the studies. They tell us a lot.

and it doesn’t explain away the mechanistic action of glucagon making the liver dump glucose into blood,

Actually, it does. It's literally data from the studies showing what reta does for insulin sensitivity. You're conveniently leaving out the part how the glucagon component is combined with the GIP and GLP-1 components, which altogether does some magic to increase insulin sensitivity much more than tirz. They can't be looked at in isolation, and the data backs that up. Lilly hit the magic bullet with reta.

making Rets inferior to Tirz at maintaining lower fasting glucose and insulin sensitivity.

This is a false equivalence. Lower fasting glucose and insulin sensitivity are not one and the same.

 

[zneekah]

Marker	Reta	Tirz
Fasting Glucose	-32 mg/dL	-48.8 mg/dL
HbA1c	-2.0%	-2.46%
Fasting Insulin	-41.6%	-20.9%
HOMA2-IR	-38.9%	-24.0%
Adiponectin	+53%	+23%

I would like the source for this data aswell.

 

[Cimcity]

I can contribute this anecdote to the conversation. I started Reta 5/16/2025. Got my first bloodwork done 7/10 and FBG was 70 (6mg Reta weekly at this time).

Started hgh 4iu in August, along with 250mg test. October bloodwork FBG was 59. 10mg Reta at this time.

I’m not really sure what this means as I have only these two datapoints for my glucose levels. I do often feel weak and faint in the morning before I eat and this seems to be worse on the higher dose of Reta. For what it’s worth.

 

[Y2_dyc]

2 weeks in combining 150mg test/1.5mg Reta/2iu HGH weekly. And although my weight hasn’t moved, the body recomp is real.

Was a little worried with the reported sleep disruption doing the GH pre bed, but for me, my REM and deep sleep have improved significantly.

It’s been 2 years since doing a proper cycle, but I do feel this stack is the closest feeling to a blast in terms of recovery. I must add that I’ve also added MOTS-C 1mg daily just to experiment with. Apart from the PIP, it certainly helps with recovery, endurance and focus.

Got Hyb’s HGH en route, which should be enough for over a years supply at my dosages.

 

[MrBillyMG]

2 weeks in combining 150mg test/1.5mg Reta/2iu HGH weekly. And although my weight hasn’t moved, the body recomp is real.

Was a little worried with the reported sleep disruption doing the GH pre bed, but for me, my REM and deep sleep have improved significantly.

This is probably my biggest improvement. Sleep. It’s been absolutely amazing! 4iu fasted nightly. I strive for 8 hours but I feel fully refreshed at 5-6.5 hours. The first few nights, like clockwork I was up at 2am pissing. It was weird, I’d wake up to piss and be wired, but able to go back to sleep. That’s subsided.

Another crazy visual effect for me has been vascularity. I’m not a veiny person. Not used to pythons going up my arms and down my legs..

 

[Freedom1]

What’s the source of that data? Without dose and duration it doesn’t tell us anything, and it doesn’t explain away the mechanistic action of glucagon making the liver dump glucose into blood, The same glucagon process that clears liver fat more quickly by oxidizing that fat as it produces sugar, makes it worse at insulin sensitivity which is fundamentally a function of insulin exposure time. Carrying the extra blood sugar around that Reta causes via glucagon means more insulin exposure, making Rets inferior to Tirz at maintaining lower fasting glucose and insulin sensitivity.

Said another way:

Reta causes constant glucagon signal → liver releases glucose → blood glucose rises → pancreas secretes more insulin to compensate = higher insulin exposure.

Tirz, by contrast, lowers glucose via GLP-1 and GIP effects without raising glucagon, so less compensatory insulin is needed = lower insulin exposure.

With this said do you believe overall tirz to have the edge since reta is so demanding on the pancreas?