First Bulk Cycle, 20 weeks planned. Any Tips?

[Smokeythabear]

some guys are more conservative but that is what I would do, yes. Do you do daily fasted cardio? that should keep some of the fat accumulation away. Doesn't have to be fasted but that helps with insulin sensitivity too. Two birds, one stone. But if time is a limiting factor just get 30 mins in a day when you can.

I play basketball at the rec center a few times a week. I was running twice a week fasted while on my cut. I’d like to get back to it after the holidays. Only good things come from it. Some buddies and I are talking about doing a relay next fall so having that to train for would be nice. I also added in an athleticism day for this training block where I’m not doing CrossFit but I’m getting the HR up into zone 2 with various exercises at a high pace that are more functional and less hypertrophy driven. Think explosive movements like sprints, box jumps, vertical rope pulls, medicine ball throws.

 

[Dial It In]

All good, I stepped on my dick a bit on the other post but I’m here to learn and adjust. I know there’s lurkers in a similar spot to me, so hopefully this helps others. Appreciate you helping me out and bringing along more good dudes.

Here is the breakdown so you know the history.

Jan – March: 150mg Test C (split M/W/F). Added 3IU GH daily in March.

Late April – June: 150mg Test C (split daily) and 3IU GH, plus 20mg Mast daily (290mg total weekly injectables).

July – August: Originally tried 35mg Test, 35mg Primo, and 10mg Mast daily. E2 tanked to 12.8 and I felt pretty numb. I titrated everything until I landed at 40mg Test, 15mg Primo, and 40mg Mast daily(665mg weekly total injectables). E2 came back up to 23.3.

Sept – Oct: When I got a bit too adventurous… Kept the 40mg Test, 15mg Primo, 40mg Mast daily base . Added Tren Ace at 5mg daily for 2 weeks, then 10mg daily for the final 2 weeks (700-735mg weekly total injectables). Added 25mg Winny daily for that last week. GH was at 5IU.

The Cruise: Pulled the plug on everything for one week in early October. Then ran a 6-week cruise on 4IU GH, 30mg Test C daily (210mg/week).

Alright here is my thought and I appreciate the detail. You’ve gotten to a good spot physically with body comp. Now we are wanting to go into a bulk. But you’ve also been on a lot of compounds for several weeks although they aren’t crazy doses. Let’s get 12-16 weeks total of trt and gh only. Let’s let our androgen receptors reset and prepare for the next piece. Next piece of the bulk is the food. Some good advice in there already from guys. Do a gradual increase of food. You can add 500-600 a week for a few weeks and watch your body comp and see how your hunger cues are going. This also allows for your insulin sensitivity to get adjusted as you go with the uptick in food. Then what’s your workout looking like? Are we doing just working sets with progressive hyper trophy or are we incorporating rest pause sets, amrap or other pieces. You can also consider carb cycling those extra calories on the big move days like back and legs. But if you are wanting to grow you’ll need to change your workout and cardio plan a bit. Now some are going to argue but high intensity cardio and workouts aren’t as effective in adding muscle as cardio in your fat burn target heart rate zone vs an aerobic level of cardio. When adding the food the fat burn zone is the ticket not anaerobic

 

[trynagains]

Alright here is my thought and I appreciate the detail. You’ve gotten to a good spot physically with body comp. Now we are wanting to go into a bulk. But you’ve also been on a lot of compounds for several weeks although they aren’t crazy doses. Let’s get 12-16 weeks total of trt and gh only. Let’s let our androgen receptors reset and prepare for the next piece. Next piece of the bulk is the food. Some good advice in there already from guys. Do a gradual increase of food. You can add 500-600 a week for a few weeks and watch your body comp and see how your hunger cues are going. This also allows for your insulin sensitivity to get adjusted as you go with the uptick in food. Then what’s your workout looking like? Are we doing just working sets with progressive hyper trophy or are we incorporating rest pause sets, amrap or other pieces. You can also consider carb cycling those extra calories on the big move days like back and legs. But if you are wanting to grow you’ll need to change your workout and cardio plan a bit. Now some are going to argue but high intensity cardio and workouts aren’t as effective in adding muscle as cardio in your fat burn target heart rate zone vs an aerobic level of cardio. When adding the food the fat burn zone is the ticket not anaerobic

Yeah funny you mention this. Androgen receptor sensitivity as well as just giving my body a break from too many compounds is why I’m finishing my cut currently with just Reta 8mg/wk, Hgh 4iu/wk, and trt 140mg/wk. I also have an IGF-1 test coming up to check my Z score on the 29th.

But I’ve read conflicting literature about AR down-regulation so I’m not sure what to believe:

“To date, the supposed hypothesis of AR downregulation caused by AAS use is a mere anecdote that cannot be translated into the real-world scenario of muscle hypertrophy because, to the best of our knowledge, only a former study published nearly three decades ago suggests T-induced downregulation of ARs using rat cavernosum smooth muscle, in which finasteride was used to increase T levels instead of T administration”

I have the feels that stopping AAS abuse for a time will make them work better later. lol. Also it can’t hurt my health so that’s what I’m going with for 3 months.

 

[Dial It In]

Yeah funny you mention this. Androgen receptor sensitivity as well as just giving my body a break from too many compounds is why I’m finishing my cut currently with just Reta 8mg/wk, Hgh 4iu/wk, and trt 140mg/wk. I also have an IGF-1 test coming up to check my Z score on the 29th.

But I’ve read conflicting literature about AR down-regulation so I’m not sure what to believe:

“To date, the supposed hypothesis of AR downregulation caused by AAS use is a mere anecdote that cannot be translated into the real-world scenario of muscle hypertrophy because, to the best of our knowledge, only a former study published nearly three decades ago suggests T-induced downregulation of ARs using rat cavernosum smooth muscle, in which finasteride was used to increase T levels instead of T administration”

I have the feels that stopping AAS abuse for a time will make them work better later. lol. Also it can’t hurt my health so that’s what I’m going with for 3 months.

I am a firm believer in androgen sensitivity. It’s one reason I will modify compounds at different times. I might use test and Y compound at one bulk or cut she test and x compound the next one. Give my receptors a break from that one specific compound. After 20 years of trial and error and finally figuring some stuff out I did notice a difference. In fact I’ve seen a long break from compounds outside of test of course, that I will respond almost like the first time I ever used that compound. Like tren. I used to do more tren then I should. Took a long break from it then introduced again and it was like the very first time all over again. If that makes sense

 

[Smokeythabear]

Alright here is my thought and I appreciate the detail. You’ve gotten to a good spot physically with body comp. Now we are wanting to go into a bulk. But you’ve also been on a lot of compounds for several weeks although they aren’t crazy doses. Let’s get 12-16 weeks total of trt and gh only. Let’s let our androgen receptors reset and prepare for the next piece. Next piece of the bulk is the food. Some good advice in there already from guys. Do a gradual increase of food. You can add 500-600 a week for a few weeks and watch your body comp and see how your hunger cues are going. This also allows for your insulin sensitivity to get adjusted as you go with the uptick in food. Then what’s your workout looking like? Are we doing just working sets with progressive hyper trophy or are we incorporating rest pause sets, amrap or other pieces. You can also consider carb cycling those extra calories on the big move days like back and legs. But if you are wanting to grow you’ll need to change your workout and cardio plan a bit. Now some are going to argue but high intensity cardio and workouts aren’t as effective in adding muscle as cardio in your fat burn target heart rate zone vs an aerobic level of cardio. When adding the food the fat burn zone is the ticket not anaerobic

I hear you on the health/longevity side, and I definitely appreciate the advice on the food and insulin sensitivity. That gradual uptick makes a lot of sense. Regarding the gear, I was on a 6-week TRT cruise and now I’m only 3.5 weeks into this bulk cycle. Since I’m running EQ and it has such a long ester, we know that it hasn't fully saturated yet. I’m currently at 350mg Test and 140mg EQ per week. Do you think staying at these relatively low doses for the next 6 weeks is still too much noise for a reset? My thought was to hold steady here for a bit, see how the physique responds to the food, and then reevaluate whether to stay put or titrate up into more of a blast. Finish the bulk when it looks like we’ve maxed out the gains and fat is accumulating at a faster clip or health markers are skewed. After that, I’d pull back to TRT for a solid 10 weeks.
What are the main cons you see with me riding out this current low-dose cycle for another 6 weeks? Is the androgen receptor reset really that much more effective on just TRT vs. this low-dose stack, or is it more about just giving the body a break? From what I’ve heard the most from those smarter than me on the topic is that the more lean mass you add and through the use of exogenous GH, the more AR your body makes or upregulates to accommodate for the new tissue.
On the training side, I’m currently doing high frequency (which translates to high volume) straight sets with hypertrophy movements and using progressive overload, occasionally pushing to failure but no widowmaker sets yet. I have incorporated some rest pause sets on my legs but not my upper body yet. I haven’t messed with any other intensifiers so far. My total working sets end up being around 90 week. I don’t do anything less than 2 RIR, so the intensity is there for growth. For cardio, I prefer the fat burning zone 2 stuff but I do want enough endurance to have short bursts of speed when needed on the bball court. If I need to shift that to be more efficient for growth, I’m all ears.

 

[trynagains]

I am a firm believer in androgen sensitivity. It’s one reason I will modify compounds at different times. I might use test and Y compound at one bulk or cut she test and x compound the next one. Give my receptors a break from that one specific compound. After 20 years of trial and error and finally figuring some stuff out I did notice a difference. In fact I’ve seen a long break from compounds outside of test of course, that I will respond almost like the first time I ever used that compound. Like tren. I used to do more tren then I should. Took a long break from it then introduced again and it was like the very first time all over again. If that makes sense

I agree with you entirely. I think it’s just common sense given that’s how the body reacts to just about any exogenous substance. Just because there may not be modern well defined studies doesn’t make AR downregulation a flawed hypothesis.

 

[Dial It In]

I agree with you entirely. I think it’s just common sense given that’s how the body reacts to just about any exogenous substance. Just because there may not be modern well defined studies doesn’t make AR downregulation a flawed hypothesis.

Exactly and we don’t need a AI answer on this once when we have lots of practical experience.

 

[Dial It In]

I hear you on the health/longevity side, and I definitely appreciate the advice on the food and insulin sensitivity. That gradual uptick makes a lot of sense. Regarding the gear, I was on a 6-week TRT cruise and now I’m only 3.5 weeks into this bulk cycle. Since I’m running EQ and it has such a long ester, we know that it hasn't fully saturated yet. I’m currently at 350mg Test and 140mg EQ per week. Do you think staying at these relatively low doses for the next 6 weeks is still too much noise for a reset? My thought was to hold steady here for a bit, see how the physique responds to the food, and then reevaluate whether to stay put or titrate up into more of a blast. Finish the bulk when it looks like we’ve maxed out the gains and fat is accumulating at a faster clip or health markers are skewed. After that, I’d pull back to TRT for a solid 10 weeks.
What are the main cons you see with me riding out this current low-dose cycle for another 6 weeks? Is the androgen receptor reset really that much more effective on just TRT vs. this low-dose stack, or is it more about just giving the body a break? From what I’ve heard the most from those smarter than me on the topic is that the more lean mass you add and through the use of exogenous GH, the more AR your body makes or upregulates to accommodate for the new tissue.
On the training side, I’m currently doing high frequency (which translates to high volume) straight sets with hypertrophy movements and using progressive overload, occasionally pushing to failure but no widowmaker sets yet. I have incorporated some rest pause sets on my legs but not my upper body yet. I haven’t messed with any other intensifiers so far. My total working sets end up being around 90 week. I don’t do anything less than 2 RIR, so the intensity is there for growth. For cardio, I prefer the fat burning zone 2 stuff but I do want enough endurance to have short bursts of speed when needed on the bball court. If I need to shift that to be more efficient for growth, I’m all ears.

Cons are you continue to introduce compounds into your system that aren’t natural this not allowing a hormonal reset. Some guys can’t help but to constantly stay on something. This is a long game and delayed gratification. Play it right and gains are kept longer. GH and test are something that are naturally occurring in our body and something many keep in year round, myself included. This also gives you an opportunity to drop ancillaries that aren’t needed thus ensuring you don’t develop a tolerance to some of those and need more and more. Pros you can get where you want faster. But if you build gains off what would like a normal stable test level that is life long feasible then you keep a majority of those gains, Right now your gains are a lot of AAS use which is a piece with the diet of course. Don’t be in a hurry. It took me years to build tissue to be 230 with abs and lean and walk around completely ripped at 205-210

 

[Smokeythabear]

@Dial It In That’s some wisdom speaking right there. I hear you on the long game and not being in a hurry. It’s easy to get caught up in the weekly/monthly changes and lose sight of the fact that I want to be doing this for the next twenty years, not just the next twenty weeks. I'm definitely sitting on what you said and reevaluating the timeline/plan I had in my head. What are your thoughts on me dropping the Test back down to about 35-40mg daily (14-16 units on the pin) and just pulling the Var and EQ out now? Since they’ve only been in for a few weeks, it wouldn't be a big deal to just drop back to that elevated TRT plus the GH and let the food do the heavy lifting in the bulk for a while. In that scenario, instead of putting a hard 20 week cap on the bulk, I’d just let the mirror, gym performance, and measurements tell me when it’s time to move. Maybe it’s a slower leaner 24-28 week bulk or beyond. During this time once my body has had a real chance to normalize and I've built a solid base with just the food and bio identical hormones, I could look at reintroducing other compounds down the road if I hit a plateau. Is that kind of what you’re thinking is best?

 

[Gonz0]

Yeah funny you mention this. Androgen receptor sensitivity as well as just giving my body a break from too many compounds is why I’m finishing my cut currently with just Reta 8mg/wk, Hgh 4iu/wk, and trt 140mg/wk. I also have an IGF-1 test coming up to check my Z score on the 29th.

But I’ve read conflicting literature about AR down-regulation so I’m not sure what to believe:

“To date, the supposed hypothesis of AR downregulation caused by AAS use is a mere anecdote that cannot be translated into the real-world scenario of muscle hypertrophy because, to the best of our knowledge, only a former study published nearly three decades ago suggests T-induced downregulation of ARs using rat cavernosum smooth muscle, in which finasteride was used to increase T levels instead of T administration”

I have the feels that stopping AAS abuse for a time will make them work better later. lol. Also it can’t hurt my health so that’s what I’m going with for 3 months.

I agree with that feelz report lol. I know people say that androgen receptors up regulate but it just feels like at a certain point after being on cycle for awhile that your body needs a break and if you were to increase the doses it would just lead to more sides.