Elite Endurance Athletes

[yannick67]

I am wondering how many guys here are/were elite endurance athletes or have in depth knowledge about endurance as a whole. CuttingEdgeMuscle (what happened to it? :-() had an incredible endurance forum with some very interesting, albeit outdated knowledge. Would be interested to know how many of a similar mindset are lurking here.

 

[cmK9s33]

I am wondering how many guys here are/were elite endurance athletes or have in depth knowledge about endurance as a whole. CuttingEdgeMuscle (what happened to it? :-() had an incredible endurance forum with some very interesting, albeit outdated knowledge. Would be interested to know how many of a similar mindset are lurking here.

I'm definitely not an elite endurance athlete and I have no interest in becoming one, but I'd definitely be interested in reading about ped's and protocols that they use. Always found it interesting.

 

[T&H]

I am wondering how many guys here are/were elite endurance athletes or have in depth knowledge about endurance as a whole. CuttingEdgeMuscle (what happened to it? :-() had an incredible endurance forum with some very interesting, albeit outdated knowledge. Would be interested to know how many of a similar mindset are lurking here.

I'm not an elite endurance athlete, but I run 6 days a week and have for years. I've read quite a few sites in that time regarding endurance forums.

If you're a runner, Google tom tinman. He is a good coach and has some good articles on his website. As much as i can't stand much of what's posted there, letsrun.com is full of elite athletes, at least it appears thst way from the race times posted. If you're into cycling, slowtwitch.com has an active forum.

Hope this helps. There's not many endurance guys here, Millard Baker is one as is Blackbeard.

 

[kataking]

I was a competitive age grouper triathlete, mountain biker and roadie. Good amateur, not pro. Ive been out of it for over 10 years though. I remember the cem board. Finding that place was like finding the tree of knowledge in the garden of eden...welcome to the dark side. Lol

 

[Millard]

Would be interested to know how many of a similar mindset are lurking here.

I'm not an elite endurance athlete, but I run 6 days a week and have for years. I've read quite a few sites in that time regarding endurance forums.

If you're a runner, Google tom tinman. He is a good coach and has some good articles on his website. As much as i can't stand much of what's posted there, letsrun.com is full of elite athletes, at least it appears thst way from the race times posted. If you're into cycling, slowtwitch.com has an active forum.

Hope this helps. There's not many endurance guys here, Millard Baker is one as is Blackbeard.

I started off as an endurance athlete. Made varsity as a freshman in high school. Won several races in 1600m, 3200m in track and 5000m (cross country). But I never pursued it at the next level. I spent next 20 years or so primarily bodybuilding/powerlifting (non-competitively). I have increasingly become more involved in cycling (recreationally) over the past several years. I would venture to guess that I would have had the greatest success with endurance sports if I had chosen to pursue it competitively as an adult.

 

[yannick67]

I started off as an endurance athlete. Made varsity as a freshman in high school. Won several races in 1600m, 3200m in track and 5000m (cross country). But I never pursued it at the next level. I spent next 20 years or so primarily bodybuilding/powerlifting (non-competitively). I have increasingly become more involved in cycling (recreationally) over the past several years. I would venture to guess that I would have had the greatest success with endurance sports if I had chosen to pursue it competitively as an adult.

Bodybuilding and endurance sport at elite level share a very similar mindset. Hours of training, few days off, dieting etc. Both are extreme sports.

 

[Millard]

Bodybuilding and endurance sport at elite level share a very similar mindset. Hours of training, few days off, dieting etc. Both are extreme sports.

It's funny that you say this. I was thinking the same thing and just posted this in another thread:

Personally, I've tried to incorporate activities into my lifestyle that will improve cardiopulmonary efficiency. I've come to enjoy cycling as a way to accomplish this. I find the bodybuilding mindset translates very well to this pursuit.

 

[$BlackBeard]

Bodybuilding and endurance sport at elite level share a very similar mindset. Hours of training, few days off, dieting etc. Both are extreme sports.

I’ve had many heated debates with guys much bigger than me about the gym work being so much harder than the endurance work.

Both are very cumulative as in the progress made to get to the pointy end takes a long time (with most of us never getting there).

That being said, in my opinion, an endurance athlete taking three weeks off will lose much more of his edge than a power lifter/weight trainer will.

In my world of running and road racing (cycling), all guys that are very competitive are also hyper focused on their weight. Especially pre- and in-season. Those guys pay attention to their diets as much as the most serious bodybuilders.

 

[Perrin Aybara]

I’ve had many heated debates with guys much bigger than me about the gym work being so much harder than the endurance work.

Both are very cumulative as in the progress made to get to the pointy end takes a long time (with most of us never getting there).

That being said, in my opinion, an endurance athlete taking three weeks off will lose much more of his edge than a power lifter/weight trainer will.

In my world of running and road racing (cycling), all guys that are very competitive are also hyper focused on their weight. Especially pre- and in-season. Those guys pay attention to their diets as much as the most serious bodybuilders.

I read about the order you lose different components of fitness somewhere years ago. Can't remember all the details of it, but your cardio/endurance is one of the first to go in the absence of training. Strength takes longer to lose. If I remember correctly hypertrophy takes even longer to lose. Proficiency at performing movements I think was one of the quicker ones to lose as well. There was a name for this whole concept, but I can't think of it. Tried Google searching it just now and just can't remember.

 

[Millard]

I’ve had many heated debates with guys much bigger than me about the gym work being so much harder than the endurance work.

Both are very cumulative as in the progress made to get to the pointy end takes a long time (with most of us never getting there).

That being said, in my opinion, an endurance athlete taking three weeks off will lose much more of his edge than a power lifter/weight trainer will.

In my world of running and road racing (cycling), all guys that are very competitive are also hyper focused on their weight. Especially pre- and in-season. Those guys pay attention to their diets as much as the most serious bodybuilders.

I don't know if it's possible for me to say which is the biggest challenge. Maybe I will have more to say in a few more years. I spent most of 20 years focusing primarily on increasing strength and size.

I think cycling requires a more significant time commitment. I rarely spent much more than 10 hours per week in the weight room. But spending 15+ hours per week on the bike is not uncommon - and even then I could probably benefit from more if I had the time.

The food/weight thing is an interesting with endurance sports and bodybuilding is an interesting observation. I completely agree.

Bodybuilders eating massively to gain weight. And cyclists eating massively to fuel performance but, interestingly and simultaneously, struggling to restrict caloric intake to lose/suppress bodyweight. A cyclist dieting on 5k calories is kinda funny.

 

[Millard]

I read about the order you lose different components of fitness somewhere years ago. Can't remember all the details of it, but your cardio/endurance is one of the first to go in the absence of training. Strength takes longer to lose. If I remember correctly hypertrophy takes even longer to lose. Proficiency at performing movements I think was one of the quicker ones to lose as well. There was a name for this whole concept, but I can't think of it. Tried Google searching it just now and just can't remember.

Size doesn't go away that easily either. Muscle memory seems to make it easier for both size/strength to return as well. That is a pretty cool thing that I've learned over the years. Now I'm complaining about not being able to lose weight/muscle for cycling. It's not as easy as you would think lol.

 

[Perrin Aybara]

Size doesn't go away that easily either. Muscle memory seems to make it easier for both size/strength to return as well. That is a pretty cool thing that I've learned over the years. Now I'm complaining about not being able to lose weight/muscle for cycling. It's not as easy as you would think lol.

Definitely true. When I was still new I'd freak out over missing a day. Now after having months off certain lifts at a time due to injury I know I'll still come back at like 90% pretty much immediately.

 

[$BlackBeard]

I don't know if it's possible for me to say which is the biggest challenge. Maybe I will have more to say in a few more years. I spent most of 20 years focusing primarily on increasing strength and size.

I think cycling requires a more significant time commitment. I rarely spent much more than 10 hours per week in the weight room. But spending 15+ hours per week on the bike is not uncommon - and even then I could probably benefit from more if I had the time.

The food/weight thing is an interesting with endurance sports and bodybuilding is an interesting observation. I completely agree.

Bodybuilders eating massively to gain weight. And cyclists eating massively to fuel performance but, interestingly and simultaneously, struggling to restrict caloric intake to lose/suppress bodyweight. A cyclist dieting on 5k calories is kinda funny.

@Millard I have been through very intense training blocks when I finished a two hour ride and everything hurt, even my hair. Kind of a joke, but at that level, that most difficult aspect is the mental one. A very common thing guys/gals who are very fit say is how strong they are. It is very exhilarating to get out after a long build and rip over some climbs or hit new power PR numbers. You almost feel invincible.

As for time, 15hrs is fairly pedestrian for a decent cat 3/4 racer. 20-25hrs where 85% of that time is aerobic is massively beneficial. However, this is after a build up where you spend 5hrs/week, then 7, 9... and so on.

About the food, it’s also not uncommon for younger racers to eat massive amounts of food, simply as recovery, and still maintain a very lean frame. This gets harder the older we get. I can recall eating 4-5k calories/day and maintaining 170lbs on a 6’2” frame. Cycling does not make you lose weight - it just makes you massively hungry. The hard part is fueling the right way and just enough and no more. It’s a borderline starvation mentality when trying to maintain weight.

Having the benefit of actual strength training for mass the last number of years allows me perspective to see a lot of similarity between the two disciplines.

 

[$BlackBeard]

I read about the order you lose different components of fitness somewhere years ago. Can't remember all the details of it, but your cardio/endurance is one of the first to go in the absence of training. Strength takes longer to lose. If I remember correctly hypertrophy takes even longer to lose. Proficiency at performing movements I think was one of the quicker ones to lose as well. There was a name for this whole concept, but I can't think of it. Tried Google searching it just now and just can't remember.

I suppose, in a sense, strength also take longer to build. Not sure this comparison will work, but I’ll attempt it:

If I took an untrained person and put them through 6months of continuous/cumulative training, I would see a very massive and measurable difference in their physiology.

If I took an untrained person and put them through a powerlifting program, I would also see a very large and measurable difference in body composition.

The endurance individual would be closer to their genetic limit I think than the strength athlete. The endurance athlete should be able to chip away at the low hanging fruit of power output, V02, etc much quicker. This is purely anecdotal as I have not studied this.

 

[Millard]

Cycling does not make you lose weight - it just makes you massively hungry. The hard part is fueling the right way and just enough and no more. It’s a borderline starvation mentality when trying to maintain weight.

That's a great way to describe it. What about trying to lose weight?

 

[$BlackBeard]

Hmmm. That’s a tough one. I think what has worked for me are a lot of small goals - as in a pound at a time. Also, when I raced with a team, peer pressure sure does play an important role. You’re doing it for more than yourself.

But, it comes down to calories. Being very vigilant and knowing your exact macros and total daily intake is a must for most guys/gals. Though you’re burning through massive calories each day does not equate to eating whatever you want. Lean proteins, some starches, tons of veggies, fish, no cheese, little red meat. Oh, and salt, like salt on everything.