Biggest contributing factor to PED induced aging?

[Eddie.]

1 in 10'000 genetic phenom. Most will look objectively worse or much worse when bald.

I think it has to do with the shape of the head, if it's a pointy one like Mike israetel then yeah, obviously..

TBH i like hair but since I'm losing it I'm gonna shave it sooner or later, but i had 2 girls i know telling me to shave it before even start getting bald. They just like bald men. Perhaps is the minority of women but still, there are many that like bald men.

Also, hair is just one feature. It's like saying i wouldn't date a chick with a nice tight body, nice hair, eyes and overall style because she has scars from cystic acne.

If you're a good looking man, fit and muscular, dressed up nicely, clean and most importantly confident, i guess you could approach even the toughest female who's against bald guys. I think we pay too much attention for things that perhaps matter but not in the degree we have in mind.

 

[Oswizzle]

You can look like Gollum and it doesn’t matter one bit …‘just have to make bank

 

[BabaJagga]

I think it has to do with the shape of the head, if it's a pointy one like Mike israetel then yeah, obviously..

TBH i like hair but since I'm losing it I'm gonna shave it sooner or later, but i had 2 girls i know telling me to shave it before even start getting bald. They just like bald men. Perhaps is the minority of women but still, there are many that like bald men.

Also, hair is just one feature. It's like saying i wouldn't date a chick with a nice tight body, nice hair, eyes and overall style because she has scars from cystic acne.

If you're a good looking man, fit and muscular, dressed up nicely, clean and most importantly confident, i guess you could approach even the toughest female who's against bald guys. I think we pay too much attention for things that perhaps matter but not in the degree we have in mind.

agree. i think if you look "that" way, bald, muscle, confident etc etc, you look attractive to large % of women cause you have "that" look and details doesnr matter.

most important i think is fact that you feel good in your body, with your look and have some kind of personality. i can look good, have money etc but im boring to them so it doesnt matter

 

[RockyP]

What would be the single biggest contributing factor to aging with PED use? Is it certain compounds? Dose dependant? Duration and dose dependant? What types of mechanisms are at play beyond just oxidative stress? What got me thinking on the subject was seeing an old picture of Dr Todd Lee, and while I have no idea how old he is in the pic, it's a striking difference between that picture and how he looks now, and kind of scary, honestly. He looks to have aged more than 25 years between those pics, maybe 30+, and yet I suspect it's probably more like 15 years between them. Are high dose DHT's like Masteron, which he talks about using at doses of 450mg/day, which is over 3 grams a week, the likely culprit for him, specifically?

If anyone knows how far apart in time these images are, I'd be very curious to know

View attachment 347864

I’m never touching masteron again…

In all seriousness it’s not clear to me that the PEDs are necessarily the driving force here. Jay cutler looks great (seems he’s had some work done on his face). Just saw an interview with Kuclo - he looks great too. Phil Heath’s face is full but not old looking like Todd’s. Then again I don’t doubt that Todd has more area under the curve of drug use than these 3.

One thing anyone who’s had kids knows is that chronic sleep deprivation ages the fuck out of you very fast. Take a look at pics of people before / after their kids are like 5 years old.

And as always, genetics, genetics, genetics. I’m sure Todd’s lifestyle hasn’t helped but some of this he may have been susceptible to. Unfortunately he does look quite older than he is.

 

[sionnach]

Age + lack of skincare (no tretinoin or other collagen compounds, no SPF50) + excess mass + DHT.

Looks-maxxers are taking dutasteride from a young age to combat DHT-driven aging, there's some science behind it.

VERY good example of excess mass (or maybe water retention?) - not even 2 years between pictures:View attachment 347881

Plot twist: the pictures were taken 3 seconds apart, he just leaned toward the camera.

 

[Liter O' Test]

1. hgh - both acromegoly and water retention
2. masteron blocks estrogen effect on breast tissue, i suspect it does this with alll tissue
3. both steve and todd are proponents of pretty high estrogen, i think this affects the crosslinking of collagen leading to women like aging, i dont know if the excess androgens counteracts that , in comparison to women, but something they have in common
4. bloat and debloat cycles, stretches out the skin and ECM , being on HGH while skin is stretched from a large cycle probably even worsens this by growing the skin

 

[newlosand]

Looks like those photos tell a dark story: the first says “bright future,” the second looks like life backed up a dump truck full of PEDs, sleepless nights, and bad decisions onto his face. Even HGH would look at that and say, “bro, I build muscle, not resurrection projects.” That face has seen more cycles than a laundromat, and judging by the hair situation, it’s been through a few spin cycles without the dryer sheet too.

 

[RandallFlagg]

View attachment 347866

I dunno man....I feel like he just looks like he went through a divorce is all. Lol

 

[shepherd]

I often wonder what drives the rapid aging seen in many AAS users. You see it frequently among pros with deep nasolabial folds, rough skin, balding, looking 50 at 30 etc.

Which AAS choices might minimize these effects? Test and boldenone could be safer options, as boldenone is thought to support collagen synthesis, you just wanna avoid crashing e2.. It also seems wise to avoid trenbolone and DHT derivatives, especially when you're prone to mpb like me and take 5ARIs.

 

[BigDadd7]

again, i disagree. plenty of guys here that are bald and bearded. add tattos to it and they look great. i personally know handfull of guys that have full head of hair and still shave it with razor or cut down to nothing.

if you care about women, many of them like that. kind of "manly" look. add muscle and you look like factory for testosterone.
many of them prefer that look, many of them dont care and ofc, there is some % that wanna nice hair but at the end of the day, it doesnt matter.

its not 1 in 10.000, not even close.

Strong cope

 

[RockyP]

all i know is I never looked worse / older than I did when our twins were infants / toddlers. Wasn't on any PED / TRT / GH at that time. I now look the best I have in 15 years on a tincture of test and primo with some GH. Facial and scalp hair is greying but no hair loss. Stress + sleep deprivation will age you overnight. I think what is attributed to PED's is largely an artifact of the individuals' genetics and lifestyle (outside of the gym / PED use).

 

[Ghoul]

I often wonder what drives the rapid aging seen in many AAS users. You see it frequently among pros with deep nasolabial folds, rough skin, balding, looking 50 at 30 etc.

Which AAS choices might minimize these effects? Test and boldenone could be safer options, as boldenone is thought to support collagen synthesis, you just wanna avoid crashing e2.. It also seems wise to avoid trenbolone and DHT derivatives, especially when you're prone to mpb like me and take 5ARIs.

AAS induced balding is obvious, as are the ways to protect against it.

What's not so obvious is the massive AAS induced growth in sebaceous glands which enlarges pores, literally making the nose larger, expands facial skin area, and contributes to a "weathered" look.

The shrinking of these enlarged pores with a full course of accutane creates a remarkable smoothing of skin and a reversal in apparent age. I think it's unappreciated because so few over 30 do this, it's mostly teens.

Lately even adult women who've gone through a course have started calling this effect the "Accutane nose job". It's even more pronounced in AAS using males.

If you've been battling bacne from gear, I recommend doing this and being done with acne once and for all. I wish I had done it decades ago, but like a lot of people was scared off (40 years of data shows us the dangers turned out to be greatly exaggerated btw.).

 

[AllGoodThings]

all i know is I never looked worse / older than I did when our twins were infants / toddlers. Wasn't on any PED / TRT / GH at that time. I now look the best I have in 15 years on a tincture of test and primo with some GH. Facial and scalp hair is greying but no hair loss. Stress + sleep deprivation will age you overnight. I think what is attributed to PED's is largely an artifact of the individuals' genetics and lifestyle (outside of the gym / PED use).

Sleep and stress are my two biggest issues, unfortunately. I've had issues sleeping since I was an adolescent, and the same with anxiety and stress. My wife and I went through a brutal custody battle with her ex several years ago. It stretched out over 2 years and cost us over $50,000 in lawyer fees. I aged more and lost more hair in those 2 years than I did in the decade prior to it.

AAS induced balding is obvious, as are the ways to protect against it.

What's not so obvious is the massive AAS induced growth in sebaceous glands which enlarges pores, literally making the nose larger, expands facial skin area, and contributes to a "weathered" look.

The shrinking of these enlarged pores with a full course of accutane creates a remarkable smoothing of skin and a reversal in apparent age. I think it's unappreciated because so few over 30 do this, it's mostly teens.

Lately even adult women who've gone through a course have started calling this effect the "Accutane nose job". It's even more pronounced in AAS using males.

If you've been battling bacne from gear, I recommend doing this and being done with acne once and for all. I wish I had done it decades ago, but like a lot of people was scared off (40 years of data shows us the dangers turned out to be greatly exaggerated btw.).

I've been considering this for a while now, and you sure do make it sound appealing. Though I've never had any acne issues with AAS use, I've had large pores on my nose and cheeks for a very long time. the possible Accutane sides have always scared me off, as has the wildly different dosing protocols. I've heard everything from daily high dose to low dose a few times a week.

 

[SwolieGuacamole]

What would be the single biggest contributing factor to aging with PED use? Is it certain compounds? Dose dependant? Duration and dose dependant? What types of mechanisms are at play beyond just oxidative stress? What got me thinking on the subject was seeing an old picture of Dr Todd Lee, and while I have no idea how old he is in the pic, it's a striking difference between that picture and how he looks now, and kind of scary, honestly. He looks to have aged more than 25 years between those pics, maybe 30+, and yet I suspect it's probably more like 15 years between them. Are high dose DHT's like Masteron, which he talks about using at doses of 450mg/day, which is over 3 grams a week, the likely culprit for him, specifically?

If anyone knows how far apart in time these images are, I'd be very curious to know

View attachment 347864

This just made me want to go natty. Holy shit lol.

 

[Ghoul]

Sleep and stress are my two biggest issues, unfortunately. I've had issues sleeping since I was an adolescent, and the same with anxiety and stress. My wife and I went through a brutal custody battle with her ex several years ago. It stretched out over 2 years and cost us over $50,000 in lawyer fees. I aged more and lost more hair in those 2 years than I did in the decade prior to it.


I've been considering this for a while now, and you sure do make it sound appealing. Though I've never had any acne issues with AAS use, I've had large pores on my nose and cheeks for a very long time. the possible Accutane sides have always scared me off, as has the wildly different dosing protocols. I've heard everything from daily high dose to low dose a few times a week.

Everything you need to know is in the "Accutane permanent cure" thread, but

TLDR: Daily dosing until you reach a cumulative total of 220mg/kg is what's needed for maximum permanent benefit. Whether you reach that in 4 months of high
doses or 2 years of low doses is irrelevant. You just modulate the dose as is tolerable. I could never go above 160mg (split 2x daily) for long, and it took a couple of months to work up to it. Others are good at 200+ a day. some can't ever tolerate more than the "standard" child dose of 1mg/kg. Whatever suits you. Just buy enough for the 220mg/kg cumulative, ie 100kg =22,000mg in a mix of 10, 20. 30, 40 mg gelcaps, which should be less than $150.

I liked the improvement so much a year after finishing the full course I started using a 5mg microdose daily for the anti-aging effect of sped up skin turnover and collagen regeneration. Of course at that dose there are no sides whatsoever, but after a couple of months really started to notice the ongoing benefits, My skin hasn't been this good in 20 years, I get complements all the time from acquaintances who can't quite put their finger on why I look so "fresh".

High end private derms in the US prescribe isotretinoin for this anti-aging protocol, but 5mg doses are no longer available in the US, so they use 10mg eod or few times a week. The problem is at 10mg you can get some slight sides (dry lips) that 5mg avoids completely.

 

[sionnach]

This just made me want to go natty. Holy shit lol.

Holy shit he's only 45?! It looks like alcohol and the wrong diet to me but I dunno the guy.

 

[abz94]

HGH (IGF1)
DHT (Hair loss?)

Think he lost facial fat too...which makes u look older (Look at chubby babies..)

Personally i think his nose looks a little different too..
Heck his bone structure looks different too..it became wider.

I actually researched the face change stuff. Anabolics make your mandibles hypertrophy which gives your face this wider shape where the jaw muscle sticks out. Looks weird.

 

[Liter O' Test]

you can tell this BB sadik Hadzovic hasn't cruised on 10IU HGH like all these other guys

 

[Liter O' Test]

I liked the improvement so much a year after finishing the full course I started using a 5mg microdose daily for the anti-aging effect of sped up skin turnover and collagen regeneration. Of course at that dose there are no sides whatsoever, but after a couple of months really started to notice the ongoing benefits, My skin hasn't been this good in 20 years, I get complements all the time from acquaintances who can't quite put their finger on why I look so "fresh".

I've been meaning to ask you this, have you seen Sam Suleks skin?
obviously he had severe cystic acne and used accutane, but he seems to have unusual skin thinning, wrinkles even, on his cheeks.

I feel bad for the guy and hes lucky he was able to make a career off of bb but do you have any idea why this could be, if accutane supposedly increases dermal thickness? doe it only increase dermal thickness at low doses and higher accutane doses combined with high AAS increased collagen breakdown?

 

[Ghoul]

I've been meaning to ask you this, have you seen Sam Suleks skin?
obviously he had severe cystic acne and used accutane, but he seems to have unusual skin thinning, wrinkles even, on his cheeks.

I feel bad for the guy and hes lucky he was able to make a career off of bb but do you have any idea why this could be, if accutane supposedly increases dermal thickness? doe it only increase dermal thickness at low doses and higher accutane doses combined with high AAS increased collagen breakdown?

High dose accutane speeds turnover so much skin thins significantly. You have to avoid anything abrasive during this time, it's easy to get scratches. It also significantly rebuilds the collagen layer at the same time so there's an upside.

Within 60 days or so of stopping skin thickness returns to normal, even faster if you're using testosterone.

Low dose also speeds turnover, but doesn't outpace growth capacity so the net effect is thickening the dermal layer, while reducing fine wrinkles, smoothing texture so much you can easily feel the difference by touch, and very visibly evens out skin tone.