Are bodybuilders drug addicts?

[birdland]

Back in the day it was test, deca, dbol. Now days guys are running 4 plus compounds, anti e to "dial in " estrogen on a lab test, peptides because others are and they have fear of missing out, glps because apparently dieting is now "suffering " and people can't eat in a defecit without cheating, "noo tropics" to help them be alert i guess, caffeine, god knows what other supplements, then other drugs for cholesterol and blood pressure because they push aas too hard, force feed, to move the scale while not necessarily looking better....the list goes on

How would you compare the two? How many different "things" does the average bodybuilder put in his body that don't actually make him look better or healthier? How far will people go , 30 different drugs a week? What about in 10 years, will guys be taking 50 different things?.lol

 

[craigdt]

What's the response you're wanting to hear?

Yes?

No?

I like to think of the things I take as tools to help me reach my goals.

But you can frame it up mentally in whatever way you need to.

 

[IndividualMan]

Back in the day it was test, deca, dbol. Now days guys are running 4 plus compounds, anti e to "dial in " estrogen on a lab test, peptides because others are and they have fear of missing out, glps because apparently dieting is now "suffering " and people can't eat in a defecit without cheating, "noo tropics" to help them be alert i guess, caffeine, god knows what other supplements, then other drugs for cholesterol and blood pressure because they push aas too hard, force feed, to move the scale while not necessarily looking better....the list goes on

How would you compare the two? How many different "things" does the average bodybuilder put in his body that don't actually make him look better or healthier? How far will people go , 30 different drugs a week? What about in 10 years, will guys be taking 50 different things?.lol

back in the day I would argue they were more akin to addicts.

 

[Elektrobot]

You are asking if 1 specific behavior trait applies to a group of people because they all have something in common

There are certainly people in this space that have drug user mentality about it- using drugs and thinking it will do for them what they refuse to do for themselves

And there are PED users.

Athletes enhance their performance through every which way possible. Equipment, training, nutrition, education, .... and sometimes drugs.

Singling out 1 of the 10,000 things athletes do to enhance their performance to ask if they are addicts is hyperbolic and short sighted at best.

 

[eery]

what defines a drug addict and how does it differ from the different avatars of bodybuilders we see?

all the things you are mentioning are tools that a smart well thought out bodybuilder strategically could implement, but also what a reckless drug addicted gym rat could abuse.

imo, it would depend on the thought process behind it all and what drives the persons decisions and behavior.


What you describe actually sounds to me similar to the average biohacker that leverages all the tools they can to optimize their life or whatever they have an interest in and so on.

 

[birdland]

What's the response you're wanting to hear?

Yes?

No?

I like to think of the things I take as tools to help me reach my goals.

But you can frame it up mentally in whatever way you need to.

I'm not looking for any specific response. Just discussion. I assume some, those who take 10 different drugs, to get defensive. Then there may be some that agree and who think its absurd the amount of drugs people use today to gain what...1% benefit?

 

[Cyp180]

Back in the day it was test, deca, dbol. Now days guys are running 4 plus compounds, anti e to "dial in " estrogen on a lab test, peptides because others are and they have fear of missing out, glps because apparently dieting is now "suffering " and people can't eat in a defecit without cheating, "noo tropics" to help them be alert i guess, caffeine, god knows what other supplements, then other drugs for cholesterol and blood pressure because they push aas too hard, force feed, to move the scale while not necessarily looking better....the list goes on

How would you compare the two? How many different "things" does the average bodybuilder put in his body that don't actually make him look better or healthier? How far will people go , 30 different drugs a week? What about in 10 years, will guys be taking 50 different things?.lol

Drugs v anabolics, healthsupps,peptides ?

Back in the day it was test, deca, dbol. Now days guys are running 4 plus compounds, anti e to "dial in " estrogen on a lab test, peptides because others are and they have fear of missing out, glps because apparently dieting is now "suffering " and people can't eat in a defecit without cheating, "noo tropics" to help them be alert i guess, caffeine, god knows what other supplements, then other drugs for cholesterol and blood pressure because they push aas too hard, force feed, to move the scale while not necessarily looking better....the list goes on

How would you compare the two? How many different "things" does the average bodybuilder put in his body that don't actually make him look better or healthier? How far will people go , 30 different drugs a week? What about in 10 years, will guys be taking 50 different things?.lol

 

[IndividualMan]

amount of drugs used =/= addiction.
if you just REALLY love Dbol, and keep taking it year round until you are in/past active liver failure, you are an addict in my eyes.

if someone is on Test mast tren, Gh, some other peptides and occasionally uses Adrol, soemtimes using more sometimes using less i would just assume they are overcomplicating the process for the sake of the experience.

 

[birdland]

You are asking if 1 specific behavior trait applies to a group of people because they all have something in common

There are certainly people in this space that have drug user mentality about it- using drugs and thinking it will do for them what they refuse to do for themselves

And there are PED users.

Athletes enhance their performance through every which way possible. Equipment, training, nutrition, education, .... and sometimes drugs.

Singling out 1 of the 10,000 things athletes do to enhance their performance to ask if they are addicts is hyperbolic and short sighted at best.

I'd argue that if someone is taking 10 drugs, the time to research, acquire, etc the juice is not worth the squeeze. I am of the bele

what defines a drug addict and how does it differ from the different avatars of bodybuilders we see?

all the things you are mentioning are tools that a smart well thought out bodybuilder strategically could implement, but also what a reckless drug addicted gym rat could abuse.

imo, it would depend on the thought process behind it all and what drives the persons decisions and behavior.


What you describe actually sounds to me similar to the average biohacker that leverages all the tools they can to optimize their life or whatever they have an interest in and so on.

I think you are onto something. I feel as if modern juice heads are almost turning into ped users and biohackers...so essentially they are using the drug load of a biohacker and bodybuilder combined. Is ped use for physical enhancement a gateway to also pursuing drugs for bio hacking? Perhaps?

Or are bodybuilders applying a biohacking mindset to ped use where anything that could potentially yield 1 percent benefit must be put in the body due to fear of missing out?

 

[eery]

I'm not looking for any specific response. Just discussion. I assume some, those who take 10 different drugs, to get defensive. Then there may be some that agree and who think its absurd the amount of drugs people use today to gain what...1% benefit?

if you have a passion for cars, and you can get different parts and things to enhance your car into the best most badass ride around, wouldnt you use what you could to get the best results, experience and pimp the shit out of that car?


you'd want to take the proper safety measures so you dont crash as well. Thats what ancillaries are for in this example, so you dont fuck yourself up by driving too fast or taking the wrong turn in the wrong situation.

 

[Duraclear]

The answer is definitively no. Bodybuilders are not drug addicts even if there certainly may be other psychological idiosyncracies driving the behavior such as body dysmorphia. AAS users may be "addicted" to being big or shredded, but they are not addicted to the drugs themselves, even if they superficially appear to be.

Splitting hairs? Maybe, but I don't think so. Addiction to mind-altering substances is a different beast, and I don't think mislabeling bodybuilding as "drug addiction" is helpful.

Of course, it is clear that there are people who continue to abuse AAS even when they have concrete evidence of adverse health effects. As an example, a new member here recently posted labs that clearly reveal early stage heart failure, yet he posts a couple days later asking if he should up his HGH dose, etc. Such a person is clearly driven by some deep and destructive compulsion, but it is not the same as the sort of escapism leading to physical and psychological dependency that drug addicts engage in.

 

[birdland]

if you have a passion for cars, and you can get different parts and things to enhance your car into the best most badass ride around, wouldnt you use what you could to get the best results, experience and pimp the shit out of that car?


you'd want to take the proper safety measures so you dont crash as well. Thats what ancillaries are for in this example, so you dont fuck yourself up by driving too fast or taking the wrong turn in the wrong situation.

I'm not referring to ancillary drugs specifically, although I'd argue if someone is doing the basics and staying lean, diet is 100% on point, steps exceed 1k, no one should need anything more than test, gh, and maybe 1 additional compound and a handful of supps (creatine, vitamin d, sleep support).

I see your car analogy but that doesn't convince me personally to change my view. I used to work at a car buying place and when dudes brought in cars with all those stupid mods, rims pimped out ride, we wouldn't pay shit for them because no one was buying that shit, most people mock and laugh at that stuff. Id say guys who pop 10 compounds and 10 supplements, people would mock too.

I mean if a dude told a psychologist or therapist he takes tren, test, eq, glp , gp, 2 other peptides, 6 supplements from gnc...wouldn't you think thry would get diagnosed with a mental illness?.

 

[bossetti]

addiction to body immage or winning/success for a bodybuilder, i bet most of them would prefer not doing the drugs but ofc they do whatever it takes.
addiction to performance and winning/success for athletes

 

[RockyP]

It’s actually a pretty interesting question. Many of us get deep into this life and it also becomes a hobby so we tinker and try new things. Other guys just take the PEDs begrudgingly to compete and when they’re off they’re off (others are constantly thinking about their cycles all the time). I don’t think that bodybuilders have a higher percentage of recreational drug use than gen pop but I could be wrong. I do know that many people in recovery from former addictions do find their way into bodybuilding / PED use. I personally never used any other drugs and gave up alcohol a few years ago. But I would consider myself to have an addictive personality so I need to be very disciplined about cruises and overall dosage management. Luckily over the decades I’ve remained a student of the sport and have proven to myself that most of us don’t really need high dosages to grow. Perhaps for a grueling cut / contest prep the dosages climb a bit for brief periods but overall most guys should be able to grow to 225+ on a gram or less with some GH. If you’re a really big fella and not a hyper responder than you’ll likely fall into the 2-3 gram range but it’s not the dosage that makes an addictions, it’s the mental relationship to the compound use etc. it’s really quite a nuanced discussion since some of these compounds really do give you a mental lift (test, anavar, dbol) and can be pretty addictive based on their pharmacokinetics (fast onset, fast elimination).

 

[birdland]

addiction to body immage or winning/success for a bodybuilder, i bet most of them would prefer not doing the drugs but ofc they do whatever it takes.
addiction to performance and winning/success for athletes

I feel like for a guy juicing, yes. But now we have people taking all these peptides as an attempt to "optimize " fat loss is easy as hell, move more eat less, yet guys take drugs glps just so they aren't hungry or just because. Anabolics I can see because adding muscle can be a hard long slow process, but no one needs a drug to get cut.

 

[IndividualMan]

if someone is doing the basics and staying lean, diet is 100% on point, steps exceed 1k, no one should need anything more than test, gh, and maybe 1 additional compound and a handful of supps (creatine, vitamin d, sleep support).

this is not the clinical definition of addiction. You dont "need" any of these things. You can look "good" at least in the eyes of the general population even as a natural.

This way of thinking is a bit odd. "I find this to be out of the ordinary, so surely this must be something pathological" is generally not considered a proper scientific or clinical approach.
It is foolish to walk the world and feeling as if any action without a motivation which is immediately understandable for you and fits your moral criteria (in this case less drug use = morally good, more drug use = morally bad) is somehow a bad thing that should be branded as such by others, even if it might be a provably incorrect way of acting towards the phenomena you do not understand.

Thats what they used to do back when they just kind of put mentally ill people in prisons (albeit they named the prisons differently).

I mean if a dude told a psychologist or therapist he takes tren, test, eq, glp , gp, 2 other peptides, 6 supplements from gnc...wouldn't you think thry would get diagnosed with a mental illness?.

They would probably be worried from a health standpoint and question if it might be self harming behaviour or what teh motivations are, but not a single clinical psychologist worth their salt would immediately jump to "You are addicted, oh my god how horrible"

 

[bananafeet]

I am dependent on testosterone because my nuts don't work. I never touched AAS before.

I don't like all the drugs I take. I don't enjoy the process. There isn't a high...

But without steroids I ain't gonna grow stronger.

When I was younger no matter how hard I trained I never exceeded 10 push-ups.

It's necessary to grow and get bigger along with food and sleep.

Comparing this to a piss pot or crack head is kinda weird.

 

[funsizedtrouble1234]

I like needles. ALOT.

 

[bossetti]

I feel like for a guy juicing, yes. But now we have people taking all these peptides as an attempt to "optimize " fat loss is easy as hell, move more eat less, yet guys take drugs glps just so they aren't hungry or just because. Anabolics I can see because adding muscle can be a hard long slow process, but no one needs a drug to get cut.

i think even there isnt an addiction,its just a shortcut not that i agree with that kind of use but i dont think its really a true addiction