About to TRT...advice, comfort and testimony?

[pierrebobin]

Hi guys,
have a drink, it's a long one.
I'm 51 and have been a weightlifting lover for 37 years, yes sir
I NEVER smoked, never drank, never took drugs.
I always ate organic, pretty balanced, have a stressless life in the country, and i am rather active,
with the weighlifting 3 times a week, my part time job and i love working outdoors on the garden.
I love it BUT, for about...1 to 2 years my stamina, ability to recover, PLEASURE when weightlifting have crashed.
Today i can only work half a day, i am VERY tired the day after a big session of squat...it really sucks.
Don't know if it's the chicken or the egg but my mood is low..."since" i can't do what i love : sports and beeing active.
According to my friends and family, my NRJ levels also seem too low.
I probably am going through a mid-life crisis, am less willing to go out with friends but, less interested in women/sex...
So i went to my Doc and had a FULL check.
All organs had a scan, X-rays here and there, all the lab test you can name, liver, heart, kidneys : EVERYTHING is fine says my Doc.
My heart, blood pressure and lipids are excellent...no vitamins or mineral deficiencies.
Total test around 600ng/dl
SHBG 70
Free 16pg/ml tested wit RIA (radio immuno analysis)
TSH, oestradiol, igf1, HGH and all those makers are OK.
Neither my Doc nor the 2 endocrinologists i saw want to put me on TRT
According to Dr Morgentaler (a bir PRO TRT), my freeT levels are right at the bottom range : he does NOT start TRT on patients unless
they have a freeT than lower than 15pg/ml (RIA...my case...i'm 16) or 100 (equilibrium analysis).
Sex drive is average...sleep is average...mood is low...very irritable...fat is adding on and it is really hard to loose it,
and when i do the muscles go away with it. Is THIS is aging, i don't like it.
Strength is going away too...very happy whan i can full squat 200 pounds 10 times.
I could do 30 of those 5 years ago.
So...UGL TRT sounds great to me.
But i am scared :
- of beeing dependant upon a substance
- that it would not change my problems, only adding beeing dependant if my HPTA shuts down.
Probably spent 1000 hours listening Dr rand, Touliatos, O'Connor, GilT, Schippen, Ruterbush, Hertoghe, Morgentaler and Co
and i still CAN'T decide...is TRT a good choice in my case?
Thanks for reading and giving your perspective on this issue

 

[Exhortae]

600 ng/dl is a pretty good value. I don’t think you need trt.

But you can hop on a cruise if you want the gainz

 

[grey]

I kinda doubt you will see some huge acute effect from TRT at those existing levels.

 

[clearheaded]

hcg mono therapy...? make ur own natural test a bit higher, and no atrophy...

would be interested on data if they know if hcg keeps test a bit higher even after a "cycle of hcg" or drops within weeks of stopping hcg..

 

[pierrebobin]

I kinda doubt you will see some huge acute effect from TRT at those existing levels.

Thanks for your thought.
IF i was to try, i would explore to find the dosage which gives symptom resolution, event if i have to go in the high levels or even above average.
I mean, i don't know what to do except this....or accept things as they are.

 

[pierrebobin]

hcg mono therapy...? make ur own natural test a bit higher, and no atrophy...

would be interested on data if they know if hcg keeps test a bit higher even after a "cycle of hcg" or drops within weeks of stopping hcg

My understanding is after you do something (test, hcg...) the body returns to normal unless the duration/dosage was such that it can't.
So a short HCG run would indeed increase my test levels, but after i stop it would go back to previous levels...

 

[clearheaded]

solution for preventing atrophy/lowering natural test at least..

 

[pierrebobin]

solution for preventing atrophy/lowering natural test at least..

i get the point yes
do you have any experience or studies or stories about HCG-only therapy?

 

[clearheaded]

0 experience, but ya plenty out there, lots of clinics offer it...esp if ur goals are just to raise it a bit to feel better and prevent atrophy. SEEMs like less downsides than T esp for your goals, obv lots of guys dont like it as more frequent injections 2-3 a week and isn't going to be nearly as anabolic.

but ya def have high t for old guy! imagine what folks feel like who aren't as healthy as u!

 

[pierrebobin]

0 experience, but ya plenty out there, lots of clinics offer it...esp if ur goals are just to raise it a bit to feel better and prevent atrophy. SEEMs like less downsides than T esp for your goals, obv lots of guys dont like it as more frequent injections 2-3 a week and isn't going to be nearly as anabolic.

but ya def have high t for old guy! imagine what folks feel like who aren't as healthy as u!

Thanks a lot
i admit i did not search on HCGonly-therapy
i will
Can't imagine what ""real lowT men"" feel like
One of the massive change is that effort is HARD today, EVEN though i am a sport fanatic... i remember those days where i felt se excited going to the gym, so good hitting the barbells...now it's a fight with my will...and i'm exhausted.

 

[grey]

IF i was to try, i would explore to find the dosage which gives symptom resolution, event if i have to go in the high levels or even above average.

I hear you but to be very honest with you that just isn't how hormones work.

I think you would be better off trying a bit of injectable B-complex for the energy issue.

That stuff will hit you like a truck compared to any "felt" effects from Test or other common steroids.

I use it myself and the energy effects are FAR above anything perceived "lift" you get from TRT (yes, I am a TRT patient).

 

[pierrebobin]

I hear you but to be very honest with you that just isn't how hormones work.

I think you would be better off trying a bit of injectable B-complex for the energy issue.

That stuff will hit you like a truck compared to any "felt" effects from Test or other common steroids.

I use it myself and the energy effects are FAR above anything perceived "lift" you get from TRT (yes, I am a TRT patient).

Thanks Grey
i doubt vitaminsB complex would change something as i had blood test on those and it was OK...which is coherent with my healthy eating.
Is it juste your personal experience?
Any specific dosage/brand of B complex you recomend?

 

[grey]

i doubt vitaminsB complex would change something as i had blood test on those and it was OK...which is coherent with my healthy eating.
Is it juste your personal experience?
Any specific dosage/brand of B complex you recomend?

It wont be showing in your blood work since B-complex whether injested or injected SubQ wll be gone in hours. It is an acute effect thing, not chronic.


I use veterinary USP prep B-complex (easily available online) though there are plenty of places that will charge you 10-15x as much for the exact same shit labelled as "human grade".

A .5 to 1.0 mL SubQ injection as a pre-workout is going to blow anything else besides meth and cocaine right out of the water.


100mL on amazon will usually cost less than $15 and 500mL bottles often go for less than $40.

 

[pierrebobin]

It wont be showing in your blood work since B-complex whether injested or injected SubQ wll be gone in hours. It is an acute effect thing, not chronic.


I use veterinary USP prep B-complex (easily available online) though there are plenty of places that will charge you 10-15x as much for the exact same shit labelled as "human grade".

A .5 to 1.0 mL SubQ injection as a pre-workout is going to blow anything else besides meth and cocaine right out of the water.


100mL on amazon will usually cost less than $15 and 500mL bottles often go for less than $40.

THANKS. will give it a try.

 

[grey]

THANKS. will give it a try.

it does sting a bit when injected.

I used to combine it with Tren Base and injectable GW-1516 in same syringe and it felt like I was injecting Satan's own semen.

You get 95% of the boost with just the B-complex though and only about 20% of the pain.

 

[buck]

I did not see your E2 levels posted. Did you get them checked? If using HCG i would assume that your body would then down regulate it's own production of LH.

 

[pierrebobin]

I did not see your E2 levels posted. Did you get them checked? If using HCG i would assume that your body would then down regulate it's own production of LH.

Oestradiol is at the upper range.
HCG would indeed down regulate LH/FSH which are already in the lower range...and then it would lower my totalT...so i don't understand why you think it would be a good idea. Can you elaborate more?

 

[clearheaded]

hcg acts like LH which then INCREASES testicle test production.

also if u can take the red b12 as its the natural methyl and apparently better than cyan.. u may not need to inject b12, just take first thing in the am as needs more acid(assume when its the highest but google that).. also for me too much b vitamins if taken after noon will fuck my sleep up. if take ant acids that can lower ur vitamin b uptake.

as someone mentioned ur test seems to be at pretty perfect levels.

you may want to check out cortisol levels as that will affect energy if too high or to low. they have spit tests so can get several readings throughout the day... also if came on suddenly

 

[pierrebobin]

hcg acts like LH which then INCREASES testicle test production.

I know, but then when you stop HCG, it stops stimulating the testies, and you find your self with FEWER LH/FSH...cause it has been down-regulated...so less LH/FSH stimulates the testies even less than before...you end up having LESS Test.

 

[buck]

Oestradiol is at the upper range.
HCG would indeed down regulate LH/FSH which are already in the lower range...and then it would lower my totalT...so i don't understand why you think it would be a good idea. Can you elaborate more?

Where did you read that i said HCG was a good idea for you?