Since Primal also offers GSO as a carrier oil, is it possible the components highlighted in green are contaminants from reused tubing/glassware/filters?
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MESO-Rx Sponsor Primal Pharma - US Domestic
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Whistles77
Member
They overlap right, but Trininolein and 7-Hexadecenal are both found in Coconut and Palm oils that Migoyl 812 is derived from right? 7-haexadecenal as an oxidation byproduct poossibly from heat in trace amounts (GCMS doesnt quanitfy trace or not as we already discussed), whilst Trininolein is the only C18 found in the ME100, which wouldn't make sense if it contained veg oil (there would be a lot of other compounds).
I feel like im missing something here. How confidently can we say that the presence of Trininolein and 7-Hexadecenal in the ME100 indicates that it contains veg oil or is from china?
I don't see the GCMS as being a perfect report, but inferring it contains veg oil feels a stretch to me (i acknowledge my feeling are irrelevant in the truth of the matter).
Photon
Member
Sure
it could be palm or whatever like you said
just not pure mct
def not 812
812 is approved for IV
you can be sure its tested and not in there
the vendor has already shows a gcms of the oil he uses.
clearly, not the same shit
the comparison made above, was by using this vendor's primo 200 vs 100.
the number of compounds is not relevant
a large part of it depends on who's doing the report at the lab
Just see how nicely done this China GCMS is
whereas the gcms done above, don't even have ba/bb...i wouldn't be surprised if more stuff turns up if you redid the test..
We cant
it may be contamination like what was mentioned above
but then that's a larger problem, because not everything appears on gcms
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Photon
Member
Tbaz192
Member
Guess I missed some stuff lol
Talmad
Subscriber
Anyone tried primal ment
Photon
Member
@Whistles77
The best way to answer your questions would be to send a sealed vial of yours in.
The Primo 100 and 200 supposedly brewed from the same set of raws, do not have the same breakdown.
The Primo 100 does not match the oil the vendor uses.
The best way to answer your questions would be to send a sealed vial of yours in.
The Primo 100 and 200 supposedly brewed from the same set of raws, do not have the same breakdown.
The Primo 100 does not match the oil the vendor uses.
Whistles77
Member
How so? We already have a GCMS of the Primo 100 from @Magenzus. What questions would be answered from repeating it? That told us neither if the oil is chinese, nor that it contains veg oil (but some components showed up on test report). If the hypothesis is that different Jano employees come up with different results, then something if massively F'd at Jano.
I don't understand the hypothesis or design of this experiment. As things stand, although there's lots of interesting questions on the differences between the 100/200 and how the misdosing occured of the 200; for the 100, i don't see anything that really raises alarm bells, just speculation on two line items in what otherwise looks like Migoyl, and could be explained by other means than china/veg oil.
I'd be game if i saw alarm bells and need, but i'm struggling to see it.
Photon
Member
Mig is iv approved and has strict requirements on what's in it. You can see the spec sheet.
The vendor has already shown a GCMS of the oil he uses, it's not even the same oil.
What you're basically saying is that this vendor is using palm oil or poorly refined MCT oil, neither of which are pharma or MIG.
There's enough GCMS in this thread, where the vendor was previously using MCT and then switched to MIG, nether of which you would see what is in the primo 100.
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Whistles77
Member
I'm not saying that at all. Don't know where that statement came from. I did mention that the two compounds can be found in Palm and Coconut oil as well as vegetable oil, but that's about as far as my assertion went. I do admit i make the assumption that as Migoyl can be made by fractionating coconut or palm oil that there may be a relationship, however i am not qualified to say.
What I am suggesting (rightly or wrongly) is that trace C16 hexadecanoic acid and Trilinolein might appear in to-spec Migoyl 812. I've tried to find evidence otherwise, but havent been able to.
Photon
Member
Mig only contains c8 c10.
There's probably over 15 reports in this thread, you would not see it in any of them.
This vendor does however seem to send out different vials to people, which was I was suggesting you sent yours.
Whistles77
Member
Got it. My understanding was that per spec Migloyl can contain trace of other triglycerides, but i can believe i'm wrong on that.
Agree that the other GCMS were much clearer, but am hesitant to jump to conclusions that this wasn't another batch of oil, brewed with contaminants from another batch, or oxidation (again im not qualitied to say, but don't like ruling out easy possibilities) before assuming its chinese or contains vegetable oil.
Sending different vials out is a whole new hypothesis to test.
Thanks, I missed the post with the GSO specs. I'm trying to take a closer look at the report but the links aren't working right now. It seems GSO contamination could be a possibility, but there is so much more in that GSO than I would have thought.
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Whistles77
Member
@janoshik test verification database seems to be down.
I was doing some digging last night, but I couldnt for the life of me find the link Primal had posted to the oil they currently use. Wanted to run some info to see if possibly the mig812 is actually closer to mig818 or a "technical" grade vs. Pharma grade. Does seem like there is an opportunity for something like this to happen from manufacturing if fractionalzing isnt entirely complete/clean. Yes, Pharma grade MIG812 should be refined of all long-chain fatty acids, but seems possible if the mig812 was derived from soy or similar product that the Trininolein could be a by-product.
I doubt thats the case since they have been saying mig812 highest quality mct on the market is what they use, BUT figured couldnt hurt to look to see if the oil company/reseller are kosher as Ive read some sketchy reports.
What about different type of Mig actually being used? Not saying this was done purposfully or blaming any party, just asking because I am not well versed in these reports and Im not going to take chatgpts word as truth lol
Can some of those veg oil findings be degradation/oxidation? Seems the oils are deteriorating in the gcsm, from the Primo starting to cleave off the ester and turning into Primo base? This is why I was thinking maybe the oil is technical grade but maybe marked as pharma? Maybe the oil is older, over heated, turning rancid, or derived from veg oil orginally (palm ect) or just improperly stored (wether at manufacturer, shipping or brewing).
It is odd. I wonder if its possible to ask Jano to run the sample again with a different tech.
Are you thinking the actual report comes out from the analyzer the same and the tech edit out the "ignore peaks 1,3,5 ect" and wrong auto-ids for better visibility? Or do you think the report comes out differently from the analyzer depending on who runs the test? Thats a whole other can of worms to tackle.. id assume one of the techs isnt following the SOP exactly, while one is?
Not sure what I would prefer... unedited, all raw information OR an easier to read "cleaned up" list. Would think scientifically theyd want to post unedited raw results so they dont get accussed of messing with data, but its also nice to see that clean and easily legible report.
Photon
Member
You don't need chatGPT at all.
You have enough data on hand, why use GPT?
This is the pure oil GCMS for 812.
Only contains C8/10.
MESO-Rx Sponsor Post in thread 'Primal Pharma - US Domestic'
The vendor started off with MCT then apparently switched to 812.
None of the GCMS of MCT nor 812, have those components.
You have over 15-20 GCMS in this thread alone, you can search and compare, no GPT needed.
Regarding the other..stuff
- Vendor buying and using wrong oil for 1 batch of brew?
- Mislabeled oil? Rancid oil? Oil scam?
- Pharma grade and IV grade 812 containing unwanted components?
- Degrading from low chain fatty acids.. into high chain fatty acids?
None of it makes any sense, if you want to buy the product, just buy it and use it. Really you don't need to justify it to anyone. Like i said, we have enough (15-20+) GCMS reports, to show, that this 1 batch, was not the same as any other batch. No GPT please.
No i don't think the reports were edited. They were just done using different conditions, heat etc. It's not possible to expect them to run it under exactly same conditions each time.
Sorry I'm going to bow out of this discussion, it's no longer worth the time.
Imo it is veggie oil, and you do not have to agree with me.
MESO-Rx Sponsor Post in thread 'Primal Pharma - US Domestic'
MESO-Rx Sponsor Post in thread 'Primal Pharma - US Domestic'
PiscesMoon
Member
Hey @k710 @crispybacon! @Primal_Pharma
Here is a new thread posted today that covers the meaning and mechanics behind the red box "Highlight" posts:
crispybacon!
Member
Thanks for sharing! I had a post that was red-boxed and thought I’d done something wrong, so this is very helpful.Hey @k710 @crispybacon! @Primal_Pharma
Here is a new thread posted today that covers the meaning and mechanics behind the red box "Highlight" posts:
CraneKraken
Member
Here's the Nolva. The weird thing is the bottle was in the same spot as the Superdrol, Anadrol and Adex I bought off him. All work great and don't show any signs of degradation. I got no answers. I can only assume it was a freak thing. Shit happens. It's no sweat off my balls, I just figured it's worth pointing out on Meso. I've been in this game for 20yrs and never seen anything like that happen before.
As for the rubber in the oils, when I get home from work I'll send some pics. I thought I took some but apparently I didn't, as I can't find them on my phone. I tossed the Test P but still have Test E, Ment and some Tren E with stopper chunks floating around. Again, I've dealt with the occasional piece of stopper in the past. Most of us have I'm sure. For me it has been at the end of 20ml bottles. The issue here is 1., by the 2nd or 3rd injection day I was seeing chunks floating around. So it wasn't simply one just before the end of the bottle. It was enough for me to inadvertently inject a microscopic piece - which is on me for not filtering the moment I noticed the slightest issue. It was such a shitty experience I'm now investing in vial spikes and filters going forward. Who knows how much microscopic silicone and rubber we all have floating around in our bodies from yrs of gear use but I imagine it's much more than we'd like to admit.
Anyway, to be clear, I don't expect any compensation from Primal. If that were the case I'd have asked him for some. Yeah, I had to toss a bunch of bottles but I also should have been filtering shit in the first place. I'm responsible for what goes in my body. Like I said, I've always been a fan of his gear and made a number of orders with him. I do think it was worth mentioning the stoppers, especially for any newer guys who aren't aware they can filter their gear, as I've never seen them degrade so quickly and easily in my 20 or so yrs of using gear from quite a few different vendors in that time.
As for the Nolva. Ha - I have no clue and have chalked it up to shit happens. I suppose i could ask Primal for a new bottle but honestly I don't even take the shit. It was needed in a pinch and his delivery was 3 days back then. It's not worth making a fuss about to him.
Gotta get back to the job. I'll get the oil pics when I get the chance and will send them to you.
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crispybacon!
Member
Thanks for providing the pic. It almost looks like moisture damage. Hard to tell from the pic, but do the stains appear to be on the outside or inside of the caps?
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