Aesthetic Benefits of HGH : BS or?

Aspiring to get that George Lopez look fr.

Notice these are also the classic “Old Eastern European Woman” type features? The wide nose etc. Their nose didn’t look like that at 25.

Women produce 3-4 times more GH than men, but estrogen keeps IGF-1 production low.

After menopause, some women keep producing high levels of GH, but the drop in estrogen takes the brakes off IGF-1, and they get typical acromegaly like excessive soft tissue growth. A lot of them would actually be diagnosed with acromegaly if they got tested, but few do.
 
This is waaay longer of a response than you expected, but “BS” unintentionally hit a nerve on this topic (and anti-aging / enhancement via medical science generally).

Yes, very real benefits, with caveats:

1. Slow and subtle. The slowest working PED those of us in this scene will likely ever use. For anti-aging / aesthetics be prepared to commit for the very long haul or don’t bother.

2. Within or not too far beyond physiological limits. The levels that produce significant anabolic results can make you ugly with long term use. This requires another commitment. To testing and managing IGF-1 / Z-score.

3. The older you are / the lower your baseline IGF-1 the more pronounced the aesthetic benefits. A 23 yo with average IGF-1 is wasting their time.

I’m not a conspiracy theorist. The narrative establishment medicine has regarding rHGH is one that uniformly denies, or at best, casts “doubt” regarding benefits of rHGH for “healthy” adults,

At the same time, the science clearly demonstrates benefits exist, even for “healthy” subjects. While trials using healthy people are rarer, they do exist, even mechanistically it's obvious rHGH can provide benefits.

The denials of rHGH doing anything positive in terms of performance enhancement and anti-aging are so over the top, it’s not an exaggeration to say it’s institutional gaslighting.

Even AI responds the same negative way medical professionals do regarding any potential benefit from this “forbidden” hormone. Denial, doubt, induce fear.

I spoke to someone in medicine about this, and it comes down to 1) establishment medicine’s hostility toward “turning aging into a disease to be treated” (yet logically, it is, and this crosses into bullshit “values” that handcuff science from helping people to the fullest of its capabilities), and 2) a deep seated fear that acknowledging ANYTHING positive regarding rHGH, will send the masses rushing to pin themselves with the “fountain of youth”.

rHGH is the *only* medication that has a federal law preventing doctors from prescribing it for any “off label use”.

As for accelerated aging, there’s some truth, not in the sense it makes you look visibly older, but that there’s a limit to cell regeneration capacity. GH drops like a rock around 25, the theory being that’s the point the body shifts from rapid cell turnover for growth (and quick healing), to “conservation” of the regenerative capacity of cells.

We simply don’t have very much info on decades of use. What happens to different tissues if you “use up” cell turnover capacity “early”. All I can say it this. The most likely indicator would be that some cells, instead of no longer turning over (and / or dying) once regenerative capacity is exhausted, keep growing as some form of cancer. On the other hand, it’s also possible we die at 100 with a mountain of unused regenerative capacity, wasted potential, No one knows.

The longest adult growth hormone deficiency patients who’ve been treated are about 20 years into it. There is no signal they have any higher rate of cancer than anyone else, or that if they get it, it’s any more dangerous. People with high IGF do have slightly higher rates of cancer. They also have better health overall and less likely to die from metabolic disorders like cardiovascular disease and diabetes, I’m going to suggest based on the documented impact of higher vs lower natural IGF-1, the higher group also has had a higher quality of life, sharper cognition, less depression, are more successful, more vigor, and look younger for a lifetime.

While the low IGF group has tons of regenerative capacity left over when they die prematurely from a heart attack, substance abuse, too slow and tired to dodge a bus, off themselves via a slow or fast form of depression motivated suicide, or just spend the last 30+ years of their lives so flat, sluggish, dull brained and ugly they wish they had the vigor left to end it.



* In many ways it parallels the prevailing attitude toward TRT a few years ago. The range is 150-1100. You’re 160, at 30 years old. Fat, depressed and unmotivated. “No testosterone for you, you’re in range, it’s *dangerous*, only to be used sparingly, and GOD FORBID, never to optimize.”
Very informative breakdown. Love this. But wondering something myself. Might be dumb so bear with me here.

So, I have 360iu of HGH for a cycle waiting to be used… what’s stopping me is the overwhelming anxiety of acne breakouts.

If I take 2-4 iu per day… do you think i’m gonna breakout super hard? Or rather, do people typically experience acne at those doses? I ask because I recently tried hexarelin…. Terrible. It got so bad I got pimples on my hairline… gross. I don’t want that happening on HGH as it’ll be more complicated to stop (need to do pct with cjc no dac and ipa ofc).

Also kinda curious if headaches are common? Hexarelin did that to me at 200mcg. I know it’s not hgh but influences the GH axis with a strong pulse…. But man that headache was intense lol.
 
Very informative breakdown. Love this. But wondering something myself. Might be dumb so bear with me here.

So, I have 360iu of HGH for a cycle waiting to be used… what’s stopping me is the overwhelming anxiety of acne breakouts.

If I take 2-4 iu per day… do you think i’m gonna breakout super hard? Or rather, do people typically experience acne at those doses? I ask because I recently tried hexarelin…. Terrible. It got so bad I got pimples on my hairline… gross. I don’t want that happening on HGH as it’ll be more complicated to stop (need to do pct with cjc no dac and ipa ofc).

Also kinda curious if headaches are common? Hexarelin did that to me at 200mcg. I know it’s not hgh but influences the GH axis with a strong pulse…. But man that headache was intense lol.

GH does make sebaceous glands more active and high IGF-1 can make them enlarge. Test does this too btw.

The increased sebum can cause an initial breakout but should subside in a couple of weeks as the sebaceous glands adjust to higher levels of GH(this happened to me, it was very minor, a couple of pimples. But
I’ve also been through an Accutane cycle permanent shrinking them, and use low dose 5mg Accutane daily for skin elasticity / regeneration). Keep IGF-1 under control and enlarging them won’t be an issue.

You’ve got to be careful with weird headaches on rHGH. It increases volume of spinal fluid, and some people have a rare issue that makes it not drain properly. It may not be symptomatic your entire life, but on rHGH pressure in the skull increases, and worst case scenario could cause blindness. If this (headaches you think might be related to rhgh) happens stop immediately and reconsider future use, or at least, if you try again, use a much lower dose and go slow. I’ve seen this happen to one guy who was 20 using 8iu/day.
 
GH does make sebaceous glands more active and high IGF-1 can make them enlarge. Test does this too btw.

The increased sebum can cause an initial breakout but should subside in a couple of weeks as the sebaceous glands adjust to higher levels of GH(this happened to me, it was very minor, a couple of pimples. But
I’ve also been through an Accutane cycle permanent shrinking them, and use low dose 5mg Accutane daily for skin elasticity / regeneration). Keep IGF-1 under control and enlarging them won’t be an issue.

You’ve got to be careful with weird headaches on rHGH. It increases volume of spinal fluid, and some people have a rare issue that makes it not drain properly. It may not be symptomatic your entire life, but on rHGH pressure in the skull increases, and worse case scenario could cause blindness. If this happens stop immediately and reconsider future use, or at least, if you try again, use a much lower dose and go slow. I’ve seen this happen to one guy who was 20 using 8iu/day.
I’ve heard some very bad things about accutane. It’s like a last resort if the acne becomes unbearable.

Wow, yeah when I got the intense headaches on hex I dropped the dose and eventually stopped completely when the acne got worse. No issue with headaches at 100mcg and when I kept the dose further apart from my tesamorelin. Also, thankfully it wasn’t that pressure buildup “behind the eyes” kind of feeling because then I wouldn’t even be thinking about HGH use at all lol. I did have spinal surgery so… idk if that may influence that spinal fluid draining issue. Guess I will be doing further research into this. Thank you.
 
I’ve heard some very bad things about accutane. It’s like a last resort if the acne becomes unbearable.

Wow, yeah when I got the intense headaches on hex I dropped the dose and eventually stopped completely when the acne got worse. No issue with headaches at 100mcg and when I kept the dose further apart from my tesamorelin. Also, thankfully it wasn’t that pressure buildup “behind the eyes” kind of feeling because then I wouldn’t even be thinking about HGH use at all lol. I did have spinal surgery so… idk if that may influence that spinal fluid draining issue. Guess I will be doing further research into this. Thank you.

I was just as paranoid as you about Accutane, started a thread about viability of low dose getting around all the scary effects you hear.

TLDR: The risks are way overblown, not according to me, but the most recent scoenfe and 45 years of experience derms have had treating tens of millions of people worldwide,

Actual harm (with the exception of pregnant women) is almost unheard of. Extremely rare cases of people with some existing issue having a bad complication.

What is true is that the sides while ON IT can suck for some people. When you’re finished they go away, but it can take a month or so, which is why some people panic and think they’re permanent. Unsurprising this got so exaggerated since the majority of patients have historically been dramatic teen girls.

Not only did I move up from low dose, but based on the most recent research and derm experiences, went with ultra-high dose.

Sides weren’t great but the end result was fantastic, and I wish I had done it long ago. Skin is perfect, pretty much always no matter what cycle I’m on or food I’m eating. If a rare pimple appears, it disappears in a day. Unexpectedly much better hair, since scalp isn’t constantly pumping out sebum. I can actually go a couple days without having to wash it and it doesn’t get greasy. I used to need 2x showers daily to keep hair looking decent. Probably would’ve prevented a lot of thinning as excess sebum plays a role in pattern hair loss.
 
I was just as paranoid as you about Accutane, started a thread about viability of low dose getting around all the scary effects you hear.

TLDR: The risks are way overblown, not according to me, but the most recent scoenfe and 45 years of experience derms have had treating tens of millions of people worldwide,

Actual harm (with the exception of pregnant women) is almost unheard of. Extremely rare cases of people with some existing issue having a bad complication.

What is true is that the sides while ON IT can suck for some people. When you’re finished they go away, but it can take a month or so, which is why some people panic and think they’re permanent. Unsurprising this got so exaggerated since the majority of patients have historically been dramatic teen girls.

Not only did I move up from low dose, but based on the most recent research and derm experiences, went with ultra-high dose.

Sides weren’t great but the end result was fantastic, and I wish I had done it long ago. Skin is perfect, pretty much always no matter what cycle I’m on or food I’m eating. If a rare pimple appears, it disappears in a day. Unexpectedly much better hair, since scalp isn’t constantly pumping out sebum. I can actually go a couple days without having to wash it and it doesn’t get greasy. I used to need 2x showers daily to keep hair looking decent. Probably would’ve prevented a lot of thinning as excess sebum plays a role in pattern hair loss.
You may have just sold me on trying low dose lol. Even with quiting hex and hcg my backne is still ugly and shoulders too. My only problem is finding a reliable place. Looking at india pharma… i’m pretty sure some are legit but they’re extremely annoying… not to sound offensive but constantly trying to close the deal when I ghost for like a week+ is hella annoying lol. Would you be able to point me in the right direction so I don’t get fleeced or did you get a script?
 
I was just as paranoid as you about Accutane, started a thread about viability of low dose getting around all the scary effects you hear.

TLDR: The risks are way overblown, not according to me, but the most recent scoenfe and 45 years of experience derms have had treating tens of millions of people worldwide,

Actual harm (with the exception of pregnant women) is almost unheard of. Extremely rare cases of people with some existing issue having a bad complication.

What is true is that the sides while ON IT can suck for some people. When you’re finished they go away, but it can take a month or so, which is why some people panic and think they’re permanent. Unsurprising this got so exaggerated since the majority of patients have historically been dramatic teen girls.

Not only did I move up from low dose, but based on the most recent research and derm experiences, went with ultra-high dose.

Sides weren’t great but the end result was fantastic, and I wish I had done it long ago. Skin is perfect, pretty much always no matter what cycle I’m on or food I’m eating. If a rare pimple appears, it disappears in a day. Unexpectedly much better hair, since scalp isn’t constantly pumping out sebum. I can actually go a couple days without having to wash it and it doesn’t get greasy. I used to need 2x showers daily to keep hair looking decent. Probably would’ve prevented a lot of thinning as excess sebum plays a role in pattern hair loss.
I always said this accutane veryl low dose long terms is far better than a large dose for 6 months then stop

And i agree unless you’re a pregnant woman its safe and doesn’t cause issues
« Depression or other shit » are just a myth
 
You may have just sold me on trying low dose lol. Even with quiting hex and hcg my backne is still ugly and shoulders too. My only problem is finding a reliable place. Looking at india pharma… i’m pretty sure some are legit but they’re extremely annoying… not to sound offensive but constantly trying to close the deal when I ghost for like a week+ is hella annoying lol. Would you be able to point me in the right direction so I don’t get fleeced or did you get a script?
Indian guys some are legit to be honest. I’m glad they are here, yes some are annoying but not all
 
Excess growth hormone makes the kidneys “overwork”: GH and IGF-1 push the kidney filters (glomeruli) to grow bigger and run at higher pressure, so they filter more blood than normal (hyperfiltration) and the kidneys can enlarge. Over months to years that constant extra load injures the filter cells (podocytes), leading to protein leaking into the urine (albuminuria/proteinuria). If the exposure continues, some glomeruli scar in a pattern called focal segmental glomerulosclerosis (FSGS), and widespread scarring can slowly reduce kidney function and raise the risk of chronic kidney disease or even end-stage kidney failure, especially when high blood pressure is a factor.
The straight up question I bet many here want the answer to: Would you use low dose (2iu) rHGH if you were borderline and/or Stage 1 CKD? **assuming normal IGF-1 levels to begin with
 
The straight up question I bet many here want the answer to: Would you use low dose (2iu) rHGH if you were borderline and/or Stage 1 CKD? **assuming normal IGF-1 levels to begin with

I like to think those of us seeking to “optimize” GH/IGF hormones using rHGH are most similar to adult growth hormone deficiency patients, and the evidence based guidelines that govern that treatment largely apply to us.

The primary difference is our definition of “low” GH is higher, and our treatment “target” maximum is a bit higher than the conservative level endocrinologists would aim for (they go for middle of the normal range, Z 1, typically, ‘optimizers’ for upper normal Z 2, or just slightly supra-physiologic, ie, no higher than Z 3.)

So with that in mind, the endo guidelines don’t explicitly say “do not use rHGH when patient has CKD”.

They say: use standard adult GHD replacement principles, but start lower, titrate slower, and monitor kidney-relevant parameters closely because clearance is reduced and GH excess can stress the glomerulus worsening CKD.

Thats the key. CLEARANCE IS SLOWER. 2iu with CKD could effectively build up to the equivalent of 5iu levels for example.

So for you, you can’t be a casual about testing. I wouldn’t allow my Z to exceed 2. Keep an iron grip on BP, and watch kidney markers carefully. If eGFR starts to edge down, back off the dose.

Whether you start at 2iu and test a few weeks later or start lower is up to your risk tolerance, but whatever you do, don’t just assume 2iu is safe because it’s “low” by the standards here. You must check IGF within weeks. Even in those without CKD 2iu can silently push IGF into acromegaly inducing levels for hyperrsponders, even more likely to happen when GH has a much longer half like because of CKD.
 
I like to think those of us seeking to “optimize” GH/IGF hormones using rHGH are most similar to adult growth hormone deficiency patients, and the evidence based guidelines that govern that treatment largely apply to us.

The primary difference is our definition of “low” GH is higher, and our treatment “target” maximum is a bit higher than the conservative level endocrinologists would aim for (they go for middle of the normal range, Z 1, typically, ‘optimizers’ for upper normal Z 2, or just slightly supra-physiologic, ie, no higher than Z 3.)

So with that in mind, the endo guidelines don’t explicitly say “do not use rHGH when patient has CKD”.

They say: use standard adult GHD replacement principles, but start lower, titrate slower, and monitor kidney-relevant parameters closely because clearance is reduced and GH excess can stress the glomerulus worsening CKD.

Thats the key. CLEARANCE IS SLOWER. 2iu with CKD could effectively build up to the equivalent of 5iu levels for example.

So for you, you can’t be a casual about testing. I wouldn’t allow my Z to exceed 2. Keep an iron grip on BP, and watch kidney markers carefully. If eGFR starts to edge down, back off the dose.

Whether you start at 2iu and test a few weeks later or start lower is up to your risk tolerance, but whatever you do, don’t just assume 2iu is safe because it’s “low” by the standards here. You must check IGF within weeks. Even in those without CKD 2iu can silently push IGF into acromegaly inducing levels for hyperrsponders, even more likely to happen when GH has a much longer half like because of CKD.
Brilliant answer. Thank you
 
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