insulin, there people who take a cc of lantus every morning like its nothing and dont even count it, its the pre meal humalog shots they count. its the only reason why Milos Sarcev can put 40-50 lbs on in a month on people on multiple occasions without fail. does he do this? no. he has his own protocols. but you tell me how much insulin a guy would need on a 4kg of carbs carb up for the 07 Mr.Olympia it wasnt no 20iu pre and post bullshit. lantus has an igf spike thats awesome and its easier to control and often doesnt last 24 hours so you can sleep on it fine if you take a shot immediately upon waking. i've heard of doses as low as 80-100 iu up to 550iu. but the most common i would say is the 100-200iu mark. as thats way easier to calculate its 1 or two shots morning and post. you dont sleep, eat shit,fuck, piss,train without being arms reach way from a glucagon pen and a dextrose shake pre made.