Retarutide + HGH (the effect of glucagon on IGF)

[Maciej]

Hi!

I was previously on tirzepatide, never exceeding a dose of 2.5 mg per week (I'm a really good responder) and lost 16 kg on it. Although I had minor side effects, I didn't like the constipation and, more importantly, the food aversion. After stopping, I gained 8 kg, so I decided to switch to retarutide. I'm currently on 1 mg per week and it's very good. I don't have any food aversion or constipation. It works a bit differently overall, as I crave food, but I fill up much faster, which allows me to control my portion size.

I want to add HGH (2-4 iu) for lipolytic and regenerative purposes, but I came across this study: Glucagon Decreases IGF-1 Bioactivity in Humans, Independently of Insulin, by Modulating Its Binding Proteins - PMC

The idea is that glucagon release lowers IGF levels in the blood. Additionally, Reddit users have also reported that while taking HGH and testing its levels, their IGF levels drop after incorporating retarutide. Of course, they were talking about slightly higher doses, such as 4-10 mg per week. I also read on this forum that increased glucagon release with retarutide only occurs at 4 mg per week.

So what's the deal? Can someone explain this to me scientifically and from personal experience? Can I use a small (1-2 mg per week) dose of retarutide and incorporate small doses of HGH (2-4 IU) and enjoy all the benefits, i.e., a great lipolytic combo and higher IGF levels?

Best regards,
Maciej

 

[lilhawk]

GH and Reta are amazing together. I use Reta at 2 mg per week with anywhere from 6-10iu of Serostim per day. Keeps my fasting bg perfectly normal and it is impossible for me to gain any fat on this combo. When dieting you will get shredded much faster and much easier with this combo. It feels like cheating it’s so easy. I’ve never had the need to go over 2mg of Reta per week so I can’t speak to higher doses of it, but I can tell you it is THE combo to use to get shredded and stay that way.

 

[Maciej]

What side effects do you have? Of course, they will be one minor one per 1 mg of reta and 3.3-4 iu of HGH.

 

[Rbvasques]

You would likely want to have high IGF1 during a muscle gaining phase, since you are looking to lose weight, you will be in a calorie deficit, which will already likely cause you to have low igf1 levels and not enough nutrients for muscle to grow.
Hgh will help you keep the muscle, and many other benefits, including the short time fat lipolysis effect.
This combo is part of my year round HRT Stack; 200mg test, 1.5mg reta, 4iu hgh.
Life is amazing with that.

 

[Endeavor Fitness]

Honestly, I'm running Reta 1mg /wk, divided into 2 doses, and GH 2 IU's 4 days/wk. I'm not so worried about IGF, because I have built my size. But, TRT + Reta + GH will give your body a good re-comp. I can have more carbs and grow, and still lose fat.

I have to look at the affected population of the studies, also. Most of these studies are on obese diabetics. I'm in the main Reta Reddit sub, a lot of good ppl. But most of them (you won't believe this). They kill their appetite, then ask how we maintain our calories.

 

[Ghoul]

This doesn’t apply to Reta.

Glucagon sensed at liver: Calorie shortage signal.

IGF-1 production and activity is suppressed when there’s a shortage of calories.

Leave more GH free to liberate energy from fat stores (reduce amount of GH converted to IGF-1).

Stop growing (trap IGF-1 in binding protein 1 & 2).

———-

Insulin sensed at liver. Calorie surplus signal.

IGF-1 production and activity is increased when there’s a surplus of calories.

Leave fat stores alone, (increase amount of GH converted to IGF)

Grow more (Free IGF-1 for bioavailability by reducing IGF “trapping” binding hormones 1&2).

———-

In this experiment they injected a “rescue” dose of pure glucagon. 10x+ the level of glucagon equivalent from Reta to suppress IGF-1 bio activity. A strong “calorie shortage” signal.

In Reta, there’s a 1/10th the above strength, weak glucagon “calorie shortage” signal. The liver releases glucose, the main point of glucagon, to raise low blood sugar.

BUT, GLP/GIP massively increase insulin release when blood sugar rises. So glucagon’s little “calorie shortage” signal is immediately neutralized when insulin is released as blood sugar rises (from Reta’s glucagon stimulation of the liver making it generate and release glucose), and as pointed out, that insulin is a “calorie surplus” signal to the liver.

The net effect of this is neutral. IGF-1 and its binding hormones stay in the same balance they were without Reta, and what tips the balance is actual calorie intake. Deficit, IGF-1 down, Surplus, IGF-1 up.

 

[ChemBB]

“rescue”

How do you type these weird left/right "quotes"?

 

[Ghoul]

How do you type these weird left/right "quotes"?

View attachment 360343

It’s automatic. Are you saying it doesn’t happen when you put a word in quotes in the post entry box?