Hmmmm...
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Phil Heath's abdominal surgery
- Thread starter Wunderpus
- Start date
JC456
New Member
Is it a boy or a girl?
Amazing that all this "bubble gut" talk seems to HAPPEN to coincide w/ "hernias"? Hmmm.
How would you not see a hernia sticking out if it was that bad?
Jankauskas
Member
Boy oh boy, its a bonanza
MisterSuperGod
New Member
Do you believe the "GH gut" phenomenon is a result of hernias or just in Phil's case?
GH hasn't really piqued my interest, so i haven't delved very deep in researching it, but my question is out of curiosity, per your statement.
Hmm, I can only speak from personal experience.... I have run high, I mean HIGH, levels of GH... and, never had any distention whatsoever. Now, I do get some abdominal "bloat" from insulin.... it goes away by the morning, tho.
Truthfully, I think the jury is still out as to what this phenomenon truly is.
My money would probably be on IGF-1, but, that would logically imply it could/would be from GH, too. There are the most IGF1 receptors in the large intestines, and we're seeing this "GH gut" really on the rise right around the time of GH'a mainstream usage and high dosages. I suppose the conversion of GH->IGF-1 seems to be the most logical explanation, yet I've never personally experienced it.
@mands @ChestRockwell @Dr JIM thoughys gents?
A hernia would have been obvious on stage
Jankauskas
Member
Its the insulin abuse. People who deny it are just users that are in denial because they want to believe its not gonna happen to them.
I think the fact that it also binds to receptors on organs rather than only muscle tissue is proof enough of this, coupled with the fact that old school bodybuilders didnt have guts and since insulin started to become popular it has become rampant.
I think the fact that it also binds to receptors on organs rather than only muscle tissue is proof enough of this, coupled with the fact that old school bodybuilders didnt have guts and since insulin started to become popular it has become rampant.
You claim to know, I'd love to see any science to back this up. Your "opinions" are not facts....
Jankauskas
Member
Didnt you claim on your latest post that you got some undefined abdominal "bloat" when taking insulin,that went away after you stopped it? Perhaps I read it wrong...
Yes, but, that's not a "fact"... You literally said "Its the insulin abuse. People who deny it are just users that are in denial because they want to believe its not gonna happen to them." as fact. You didn't say "maybe" or "possibly" causes it, you said it DOES. Now, around here, we like a little more evidence to back up absolute claims. My experience in no way should indicate proof positive of your theories, it just doesn't make sense.
Also, you would be wise to note, I said the bloat dissipates. Obviously it does not in these competitors.... I generally believe the "bloat" I experience is correlated to the influx of fast carbs and a bit of "overeating" as I'm normally in a mass gaining phase while using insulin. This is likely why it dissipates by the morning... Or, it COULD be the insulin.... I'm not entirely sure.
Jankauskas
Member
I highly doubt that it will be proved by science anytime soon since that would require a case study and human trials, which will never happen, so they would have to find another way to prove it.
Maybe its a massive refeed the day before the competition, but the guys look like their lower abdomen is literally going to pop at any second, and thats not where the stomach is located.
Maybe its too much muscle, but then again it looks like a bubble.
The only viable explanation IN MY OPINION (happy now?) Is that its organomegaly induced by insulin, and derived peptides and the use of megadose Gh.
I BELIEVE this is pretty obvious, and I cannot think of any other explanation for this phenomenon, especially since dead bodybuilders often have enlarged internal organs, as seen in their autopsy.
I figure if it's a refeed issue, a lot of other classes would show this issue, and they don't (women's figure, bikini, mens physique, classic, etc.)...
I do tend to agree, it is probably somehow connected to one or more of those substances (insulin, IGF-1, GH)... But we just don't KNOW yet. I know a lot of guys that run a lot of GH that do not have the distention, and then there are guys like Phil or Winklaar who just blow up... Who knows?
I figured this whole "hernia" thing was just an excuse to get an operation done to somehow reduce the appearance of the guts.
Jankauskas
Member
He might have had a hernia and repaired it but this was severely overblown into drama so we can all have pity of the poor champ who maybe didnt deserve to win and forget about all of this gut talk.
Or maybe he had something serious like a tumour and said it was only a hernia so (inocent) people and fans wouldnt acuse him of taking sports technology.
Those are just my theories anyway.
I would have to concur with all of the above. @Wunderpus is on the right track with the organs in that area having a high amount of IGF-1 receptors.
I believe it is the combination of high doses of GH, IGF-1, AAS and other PED's(insulin) along with high amounts of food intake for long periods at a time.
There is also a case that heavier guys like myself that are holding more and more muscle will have growth in the core area to sustain that extra weight we hold.
I would suggest for anyone that is trying to minimize an extend belly to do these:
1. No more than 8-10 iu's a day of GH.
2. No longer than 3-4 month of GH use at higher doses.
3. Insulin use not to exceed desired amount needed. Do not overfeed with carb intake.
3. Avoid IGF-1 while on GH.
4. Shorter blasts of AAS.
5. Smaller portion meals even on re-feed days.
6. Vacuum exercises.
7. DO NOT take GH, Insulin, IGF-1 and AAS.
mands
I believe it is the combination of high doses of GH, IGF-1, AAS and other PED's(insulin) along with high amounts of food intake for long periods at a time.
There is also a case that heavier guys like myself that are holding more and more muscle will have growth in the core area to sustain that extra weight we hold.
I would suggest for anyone that is trying to minimize an extend belly to do these:
1. No more than 8-10 iu's a day of GH.
2. No longer than 3-4 month of GH use at higher doses.
3. Insulin use not to exceed desired amount needed. Do not overfeed with carb intake.
3. Avoid IGF-1 while on GH.
4. Shorter blasts of AAS.
5. Smaller portion meals even on re-feed days.
6. Vacuum exercises.
7. DO NOT take GH, Insulin, IGF-1 and AAS.
mands
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Jankauskas
Member
Just to clarify point 7, you mean one should not take all of these substances at the same time, right?
Sorry I meant DO NOT take any of them.
But, yes you can minimize by not using multiple PED's with synergy to accelerate the issue.
mands
Who is this .... commenting about PHs "health issue" and why would a physician "come to me (him)" to explain the "seriousness of Phils condition"?
People live with hernias for decades and often do fine but request surgery
to correct the protrusion for cosmetic
reasons and a "three inch hernia" is no exception.
Finally hernias have a recurrence rate
ranging bt 0-100% depending upon a variety of factors and umbilical hernias are at the higher end .
Jim
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